Keybase and Stellar is live for everyone • Hacker News Board

Re: Keybase and Stellar is live for everyone

#81

Post by arshbot » Wed, May 15, 2019, 2:36 PM UTC

drawnwren wrote: post #79

RustyRussell wrote: post #68

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (1) the lightning network has been repeatedly attacked as unworkable trash [ Disclosure: I work on the lightning specification and one of the implementations ] I'm sure it has been attacked (because "cryptos, bro"), I'm disappointed that it made you dismiss it. FWIW, I switched from Linux Kernel development to developing Lightning after almost 20 years: I find it ambitious, high-potential and fascinating, as well a…

I don't mean to attack you. It's just that there is a large gap between well-engineered and easy to use. I am 100% certain you're a better developer than I, and that lightning is not a result of poor engineering. But if a layman can't pick it up and use it in under 5 minutes, it's unworkable (if you're targeting laymen). Crypto is full of genius engineers, and product folks, but I think there is (and always has been)…

> I am 100% certain you're a better developer than I, and that lightning is not a result of poor engineering. But if a layman can't pick it up and use it in under 5 minutes, it's unworkable (if you're targeting laymen).

In this scenario linux is unworkable since a cli is probably too much for a layman. But that's why people built gnome and other window managers on top of the "unworkable" but useful core.

All we have to do is wait for some people to build that nice pretty layer on top - but the core must be an efficient tool

Re: Keybase and Stellar is live for everyone

#82

Post by drawnwren » Wed, May 15, 2019, 2:44 PM UTC

arshbot wrote: post #81

drawnwren wrote: post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't mean to attack you. It's just that there is a large gap between well-engineered and easy to use. I am 100% certain you're a better developer than I, and that lightning is not a result of poor engineering. But if a layman can't pick it up and use it in under 5 minutes, it's unworkable (if you're targeting laymen). Crypto is full of genius engineers, and product folks, but I think there is (and always has been)…

> I am 100% certain you're a better developer than I, and that lightning is not a result of poor engineering. But if a layman can't pick it up and use it in under 5 minutes, it's unworkable (if you're targeting laymen). In this scenario linux is unworkable since a cli is probably too much for a layman. But that's why people built gnome and other window managers on top of the "unworkable" but useful core. All we have…

Yeah, I would say linux _is_ unworkable for laymen. If crypto were trying to sell itself as infrastructure, I would agree with your statement. But 'just wait for the nice pretty layer' is what people have been saying about btc for the last 10 years.

Re: Keybase and Stellar is live for everyone

#83

Post by thanatos_dem » Wed, May 15, 2019, 7:25 PM UTC

ricardobeat wrote: post #54

thanatos_dem wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup... I was part of one of the first XLM grants. I saved my credentials and stopped paying attention until recently when I tried to go to my account. There was some sort of wallet migration needed due to a security issue, and it needed to be done years ago, so it’s all just gone now. Stellar, like the rest of the cryptocurrencies, can go die in a fire as far as I’m concerned.

So you're angry that the virtual money you got as a handout, from a system in early development, was lost four years later after you failed to act on an upgrade announced months in advance. Sounds fair.

Not so much angry as frustrated.

Crypto currencies overlook the benefits of a centralized currency - some entity to correct mistakes. Fiat currency is backed by the trust in a nation state for example. If my money disappears, I have some authority I can appeal to for addressing it. Whether they do address it or not is a different question, but at least there’s a process.

When someone in stellar screws up and locks out wallets, or when Mt. Gox loses mounds of bitcoins, there is no recourse. Just a “oh, the math makes fixing that impossible” response. Or they can take the ethereum approach and just rewrite history to cover up your mistakes, delegitimizing the entire currency in the process.

In a world with pure intentions and no mistakes that may work, but the real world is messy and people are any combination of stupid, forgetful, and malicious.

Crypto currencies and distributed ledgers are interesting in theory, but will fail due to the implications of needing to operate in the real world.

Re: Keybase and Stellar is live for everyone

#84

Post by phyzome » Sat, May 18, 2019, 1:16 AM UTC

rickycook wrote: post #67

phyzome wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It sounds like Stellar would be a bad fit for your use-case, then, even while Bitcoin is useful.

why is that? you can still interact with the stellar network with just xlm->xlm; you don’t have to pass it through and anchor to pay in some fiat-backed token

Ah, OK. I've had a pretty hard time understanding Stellar's model. It seems pretty complicated.