Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released • Hacker News Board

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#81

Post by _red » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:32 PM UTC

CoolGuySteve wrote: post #61

avar wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Pretty colors when running dmesg! Neat, but a great isolated example of the ancient software people who use RHEL have to deal with. RHEL 7 has dmesg from util-linux 2.23, the "colors by default" feature[1] first came out with 2.24 released on October 21st, 2013, which is around the time[3] the first beta of RHEL 7 came out. 1. https://github.com/karelzak/util-linux/commit/9bc2b51a06dc9c... 2. https://github.com/kar…

I've always felt that RHEL really excels at that old school corporate Unix feel of having to deal with stodgy tools that are either really old and/or lack basic ease of use features. Reminds me of the time I wrote a script that called 'hostname -x' on SunOS instead of Solaris and it changed the hostname to '-x' and broke X11. RHEL is the nostalgia Linux. But seriously, has anyone ever empirically verified that the De…

>layering years of patches over top actually generates more stable, more secure code

Well, I think your definition of 'stable' is different than what RHEL/Debian customers think. Stable isn't seen as "doesn't have bugs", its "works predictably". Which is a subtle but meaningful difference.

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#82

Post by Skunkleton » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:32 PM UTC

tannhaeuser wrote: post #76

sparkling wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It makes a lot of sense that OS-stuff points to a seperate Python interpreter, don't you think? I like this approach.

Yes and no. It absolutely makes sense to ensure that admin scripts used by RHEL run in a predictable, tested environment; even more so since Python has dropped backward portability. OTOH not even being able to rely on Python's presence is exactly the kind of thing that makes Python unsuitable as the shell replacement it is being promoted as.

Is python being promoted as a wholesale shell replacement? There certainly are plenty of overlapping usecases, but shell is a better fit for many of these tasks. Until something like ipython can replace the interactive shell, I don't see python replacing shell scripts entirely.

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#83

Post by pnutjam » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:42 PM UTC

hadrien01 wrote: post #45

pnutjam wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

looks like a toned down version of webmin.

It's Cockpit. http://cockpit-project.org/

Yeah, I know it's cockpit. I'm not sure what it brings to the table. It's already possible to lock down webmin pretty heavily if I want to trust a windows admin to do linux.

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#84

Post by pnutjam » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:43 PM UTC

devops4free wrote: post #67

pnutjam wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Download CentOS grep -rli 'centos' * | xargs -i @sed -i 's/centos]/Oracle\ Unbreakable\ Linux/gi' @ done

Why would you waste cycles invoking grep and xargs and memory piping data back and forth, where pure sed can do it? ;)

Oracle has some pretty beefy hardware. They can afford the cycles. ;)

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#85

Post by pnutjam » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:44 PM UTC

digitalsushi wrote: post #57

pjmlp wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is a little bit more than that.

I know there's quite a bit of testing involved to verify their unbreakable kernel stuff and ksplice stuff is compatible. I would suspect there is also the spacewalk integration stuff that is fairly different than redhat's satellite stuff.

I didn't realize, until recently, that satellite 6 is no longer based on spacewalk.

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#86

Post by nightfly » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:44 PM UTC

wazoox wrote: post #50

pnutjam wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

looks like a toned down version of webmin.

It's "cockpit"; I regularly give it a try, looking for a better structured, more elegant webmin replacement; alas, cockpit has like 5% of webmin features.

But does it at least do that 5% well?

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#87

Post by eclipseo76 » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:46 PM UTC

CiPHPerCoder wrote: post #54

beefhash wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it perhaps in a separate package, at least?

No. https://twitter.com/fkooman/status/1125767993764536321

In EPEL probably https://twitter.com/RemiCollet/status/1063323527770750976

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#88

Post by secabeen » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:47 PM UTC

CoolGuySteve wrote: post #61

avar wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Pretty colors when running dmesg! Neat, but a great isolated example of the ancient software people who use RHEL have to deal with. RHEL 7 has dmesg from util-linux 2.23, the "colors by default" feature[1] first came out with 2.24 released on October 21st, 2013, which is around the time[3] the first beta of RHEL 7 came out. 1. https://github.com/karelzak/util-linux/commit/9bc2b51a06dc9c... 2. https://github.com/kar…

I've always felt that RHEL really excels at that old school corporate Unix feel of having to deal with stodgy tools that are either really old and/or lack basic ease of use features. Reminds me of the time I wrote a script that called 'hostname -x' on SunOS instead of Solaris and it changed the hostname to '-x' and broke X11. RHEL is the nostalgia Linux. But seriously, has anyone ever empirically verified that the De…

> But seriously, has anyone ever empirically verified that the Debian Stable/RHEL model of shipping a bunch of really old packages and then layering years of patches over top actually generates more stable, more secure code?

Debian has released a new stable version every 2 years for the last 14 years. RHEL/CentOS are the only ones on a 3-5 year cycle.

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#89

Post by pnutjam » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:55 PM UTC

ilovecaching wrote: post #10

With Shadowman gone and Redhat now a branch of IBM, this RHEL release is really dampened for me.

Never a better time to try OpenSuse and pitch SLES at work.

Re: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 8 released

#90

Post by X-Istence » Tue, May 07, 2019, 5:59 PM UTC

lima wrote: post #65

avar wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Pretty colors when running dmesg! Neat, but a great isolated example of the ancient software people who use RHEL have to deal with. RHEL 7 has dmesg from util-linux 2.23, the "colors by default" feature[1] first came out with 2.24 released on October 21st, 2013, which is around the time[3] the first beta of RHEL 7 came out. 1. https://github.com/karelzak/util-linux/commit/9bc2b51a06dc9c... 2. https://github.com/kar…

Most things on RHEL 7 aren't ancient - there's plenty of backports, even major ones. Some examples: - OpenSSL rebase to 1.0.2k (for HTTP/2 support). - overlayfs2 kernel support. - Kernel eBPF instrumentation. - Introduction of podman and friends. - Ansible is kept up-to-date. - GCC 7 and Python 3.6 via Software Collections. This includes extensive testing. I have non-production systems on Fedora which run mainline ke…

Some of the backports aren't nearly as fast or performant as using a newer kernel though.

For example eBPF was back ported (and also in CentOS), but running a syscall heavy work-load in a docker container on the older kernel about 50% of the CPU time was spent in the kernel filter.

I ended up moving our entire CI/CD platform to Ubuntu 18.04 and the performance issues went away and my workloads now run at full speed without slowdowns.

RHEL 8 comes with the 4.18 series of the Linux kernel that is already EOL. That's a shame and once again it will fall behind quickly :/