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Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

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Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#81

Post by mattkrause »

minikites wrote: post #47
joegyoung wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the Clean episode of "How we got to now" with Steven Johnson, Steven states that the beer-brewing process kills disease. Although no-one realises this in the middle of the 19th century, it means if you live in an unclean environment, beer is a very sensible drink. >> https://subsaga.com/bbc/documentaries/science/how-we-got-to-...

Beer in the medieval period through 19th century was hardly alcoholic, so this is a foolish argument. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Small_beer >At mealtimes in the Middle Ages, everyone could drink small beer, including children, while eating a meal at the table. Table beer was around this time typically less than 1% ABV.

Boiling, however, is also a key part of the brewing process and it does a smashing job killing germs....

Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#82

Post by mirimir »

Marsymars wrote: post #73
mirimir wrote: post #44

So does 10 mg zolpidem tartrate. As in, totally prevents memory formation. Gotta be careful with that stuff. And prototypically, marijuana. Back in the day, I'd always see movies stoned. That way, if I liked them, I could see them again freshly. And if I didn't liked them, I could forget about them more easily.

Brain injury can also obliterate memory abilities. I've had a single moderate concussion, where one of my first memories afterwards is of sitting in the hospital emergency room with a couple friends. I had a notebook with my handwriting, containing several pages of questions/answers that my friends had me write down so they could stop repeating themselves to me.

Hey, but at least you had friends and something to write with :)

    Overwhelmed as one would be, placed in my position
    Such a heavy burden now to be the one
    Born to bear and bring to all the details of our ending
    To write it down for all the world to see
    But I forgot my pen
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VZXJLQntCP0

Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#83

Post by mattkrause »

noarchy wrote: post #39
vasilipupkin wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Geez, lighten up. Yes, some people definitely develop alcohol addiction but about 80% do not and are free to enjoy good quality drinks that not only give you a buzz, but also potentially taste great like good wine or whisky or mezcal.

I think there is almost a neo-Prohibitionist attitude coming from some, of late. Though this is largely anecdotal, I think it got ratcheted up by the movement to see marijuana legalized, where weed has often been compared to alcohol. Aside from this, I agree that the vast majority can enjoy these substances without destroying themselves, leading very productive lives with some of the evident downsides that even casua…

I always wonder how much publication bias exists in these fields: “Drug X isn’t that bad for you” seems like it might be a lot harder to publish than series of papers ratcheting up the severity of some bad effects.

Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#84

Post by crehn »

par wrote: post #75
nostrebored wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Source? This is completely counter to my experience and everything that I know about alcohol

Neurogenic studies of alcohol addiction: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC2607330/ Could you post a source that shows alcohol relaxes you?

So you don't feel more relaxed after a drink?

Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#85

Post by rgbrenner »

pm90 wrote: post #67
rgbrenner wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's interesting.. I wasn't aware this was studied. I stopped drinking years ago because I noticed that alcohol reduced the amount of code I could hold in my head, even up to a week later.

How much code do you hold in your head?

I don't think there's a good answer to this... it varies depending on the language, familiarity of the codebase, complexity, novelty/difficulty of the problem/solution, how repetitive the code is, etc. So I don't think comparisons can be made between people, even if they're looking at the same code base (since what is difficult for me, may be easy for you, and therefore easier for you to comprehend and remember... but if we look at another codebase, the opposite may be true.)

Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#87

Post by samatman »

par wrote: post #70
ra88it wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I think it is quite normal. Alcohol is a cheap, ubiquitous drug that helps us relax today, for a roughly proportionate cost which we can pay tomorrow (plus whatever longer-term costs like liver damage or memory formation which we can ignore or put off for even longer). It's not confusing or unintuitive. Alcohol helps us relax. That's all it does! Which leads to all the other behaviors that are secondary to sudde…

The idea that alcohol helps people relax is actually an old (and incorrect) way of thinking about alcohol. The 'relaxtion' that is felt by alcohol is actually due to its addictiveness, and the cycle it puts you in. By drinking, you are entering a cycle where you crave the next drink, which is why it 'relaxes' you, it is actually just removing the very craving it places in you.

You’re basically correct about the mechanism of addiction but wrong about alcohol and relaxation.

I drink maybe twice a month. It’s relaxing. I am in no sense addicted to alcohol.

Alcohol is primarily a GABAergic, so of course it’s relaxing. Habitual use will down-regulate those receptors, and the addictive cycle is triggered by medicating the resulting anxiety with more alcohol. None of this is surprising.

Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#88

Post by samatman »

par wrote: post #72
vasilipupkin wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Geez, lighten up. Yes, some people definitely develop alcohol addiction but about 80% do not and are free to enjoy good quality drinks that not only give you a buzz, but also potentially taste great like good wine or whisky or mezcal.

You'll find that alcohol is a lot like cigarettes. Cigarettes used to be everywhere, even doctors would prescribe cigarettes to their patients. Then people started slowly waking up to the idea that nicotine is a highly addictive and toxic substance. People started looking at cigarettes differently, they stopped putting cigs in movies, and people stopped glamorizing cigarettes in the media. Now we have big warnings on…

Addictive, certainly. Toxic at normal doses? Evidence says no.

Carbon monoxide, tar, and tiny soot particles are very bad for you. Nicotine? Not so much.

Addiction is annoying as hell and I don’t recommend it. But let’s be accurate.

Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#89

Post by 0x8BADF00D »

Smithalicious wrote: post #69
ra88it wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I think it is quite normal. Alcohol is a cheap, ubiquitous drug that helps us relax today, for a roughly proportionate cost which we can pay tomorrow (plus whatever longer-term costs like liver damage or memory formation which we can ignore or put off for even longer). It's not confusing or unintuitive. Alcohol helps us relax. That's all it does! Which leads to all the other behaviors that are secondary to sudde…

>Alcohol is a cheap, ubiquitous drug that helps us relax today, for a roughly proportionate cost which we can pay tomorrow While I like this metaphor I don't think it's really true. As long as you drink in moderation the relaxation benefits easily outweigh the negatives. Of course, the converse is also true, you can drink so much that the negatives dwarf the positives.

It depends on how strong your heart is. You have no way of knowing until you have an MI or adverse cardiac event. That’s why high blood pressure is termed the “silent killer”. Same for your liver. You will not know the extent of the damage until your liver enzymes are elevated, at which point it’s too late to undo the damage.

I’m not saying that you shouldn’t drink at all, but just that you should be aware of the consequences because they are non-zero.

Re: Just a few drinks can change how memories are formed

#90

Post by ajcodez »

soared wrote: post #15
rconti wrote: post #9

I know everyone is recommending the book Why We Sleep, but I'll pile on and say that I found it to be a fantastic read, and the consequences of alcohol consumption are devastating. Stats like 40+% reduction in retained information from just a few drinks the night after learning new facts. Or the night BEFORE learning new facts. And how the ill consequences occur even if you abstain for several DAYS after learning new…

Honest question - Do most adults need to retain new information very often?(excluding the typical HN audience who are constantly learning/innovating/reading/etc)

Another question - do you benefit more from social ties formed while drinking or preservation of memory and early mornings?
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