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Librem5 Hardware Update

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Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#81

Post by pessimizer »

eudora wrote: post #64
dvfjsdhgfv wrote: post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When you think about it, it amazes me. So many people, including me, would love to have these switches. Like physical switch for the mic, camera and radio. And yet, the companies that are supposed to listen to the customer seem to do exactly the opposite to what the customer wants, like installing all these unremovable crappy apps nobody uses or removeing the headphone jack. Are these people so out of touch with real…

Hold up. I don't have stats but I'm incredibly confident that almost no users want hardware switches. Does your mum want a hardware switch? Does the guy working at Starbucks? I think it might be the techheads who think that installing Linux and having hardware switches are normal - they're the ones who are out of touch with reality.

> I'm incredibly confident that almost no users want hardware switches.

I'm incredibly confident that almost everyone does. They'd explain it as the ability to turn off the microphone or camera without someone else having the ability to turn it back on without asking you, but it amounts to the same thing.

One thing I know nobody is asking for is microphones and cameras that can be turned on without their consent after they've explicitly turned them off.

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#82

Post by pessimizer »

jsjohnst wrote: post #77
lvs wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anecdotally, I do see a large number of lay people with tape over their laptop cameras. Enough stories have filtered into the press about RAT malware and whatnot that there is likely to be some endemic insecurity about a camera pointed in your face across a fairly broad section of the populace.

Yet those tinfoil folks who cover the camera do nothing about the microphone. Since ~2009, it’s been impossible to turn on the camera on an Apple laptop/monitor without the light turning on, yet there’s no indication of something using the mic.

> Yet those tinfoil folks who cover the camera do nothing about the microphone.

You say this like it's a "gotcha," but what exactly could somebody with no technical knowledge do about the microphone? If you're trying to say that if there were an equivalent to electrical tape but for the microphone, people wouldn't use it, then I don't even think you honestly believe that.

Also, it's bizarre that in a world that ratting has existed, you'd compare covering the camera on your laptop with a piece of electrical tape to paranoid schizophrenia.

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#83

Post by _emacsomancer_ »

djsumdog wrote: post #29
floatboth wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> crack the firmware In most cases, you don't have to crack anything, you can officially unlock the bootloader and flash your own OS build. Yes, you can't touch the early boot initialization, you're still required to use vendor blobs for using wireless/modem/camera/etc things, but you can control most of the software that matters.

Yea using adb/oemunlock. Sometimes you have to get a code (like with Sony, you input your IMEI number into their website and get one). I've had one Sony that was unlockable; a condition of the original cell provider. Still, it's bizarre considering you can install Linux on any PC/laptop you buy. The bigger issue of course, is that you can't just install Linux on a phone. They're all random pins soldered to random chi…

> Still, it's bizarre considering you can install Linux on any PC/laptop you buy.*

* Unless it's a 2018 Mac ( https://www.theregister.co.uk/2018/11/06/apple_mac_linux_woe... )....

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#84

Post by joshumax »

cyphar wrote: post #59
conradev wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see. The question here is not if there will be proprietary software: there will be. The question is which of that proprietary software runs on the CPU. Is the idea that all of the software in the kernel to interface with these devices is open source? I also don’t get the hangup over PCIe (vs USB). DMA with an IOMMU can be made fairly secure (and has obvious perf benefits).

I think the main reason is that powering off a device (for their hardware kill switches) connected via USB is more reliable than powering off a device connected via PCIe. There's also just more layers of security when using USB as opposed to a single layer with PCIe (IOMMU -- which is secure as far as I know but I'd prefer to be safe rather than sorry in this case).

Besides IOMMU bugs, which silicon vendors often subtly add to their errata too much for my comfort; an IOMMU adds security against DMA attacks in theory. I specifically say in theory because oftentimes vendors either don't configure it correctly or leave it totally unconfigured. Additionally, things like multiplexing on the same bus further complicates things

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#85

Post by ShorsHammer »

yogthos wrote: post #21

It’s hard to overstate how important Librem phone is. Currently, it’s pretty much impossible to buy a high end phone that you can actually own. All Android based phones have their firmware locked and root access disabled. This effectively means that you do not own the device, and you don’t get the final say as to what will be running on it. I’m aware that it’s possible to crack the firmware, but I think that’s comple…

> All Android based phones have their firmware locked and root access disabled

Xaiomi A1 and A2 come with stock android and official bootloader unlock on the website, takes 10 mins to unlock and install LineageOS. LineageOS root access is an option in the settings.

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#86

Post by Galanwe »

As an expat living in HK, I did not quite understand the explanations about delays at the beginning of the article.

The golden week is Japanese, not Chinese. Nothing closes in China at that time. And it’s in may/april.

Mangkhut did not really hit China mainland, it was already mainly just a storm when it reached mainland, and it died in 1/2 days once leaving the sea. I guess most of the factories are near Shenzhen, they should not have really suffered from Manghkut.

Just wanted to rectify that...

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#87

Post by bo1024 »

rgrieselhuber wrote: post #49

Any experiences with their laptops?

I like mine (a 13). Hardware seems very solid, battery life is good. Screen, keyboard, touchpad are fine for me (some people are very picky about these things). Having the kilswitches for mike/camera and wireless/bluetooth are nice. I was on a 2013 13" MacBook Pro previously (an amazing piece of hardware as well) and can't say I miss it.

The only thing I miss actually is the 16x10 aspect ratio of the MBP, where the Librem like all other laptops I know of is 16x9.

Software-wise I've stuck to PureOS (which is Debian-based) despite temptations to install Arch or something. It's worked fine for me.

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#88

Post by philipswood »

StreamBright wrote: post #60
yogthos wrote: post #21

It’s hard to overstate how important Librem phone is. Currently, it’s pretty much impossible to buy a high end phone that you can actually own. All Android based phones have their firmware locked and root access disabled. This effectively means that you do not own the device, and you don’t get the final say as to what will be running on it. I’m aware that it’s possible to crack the firmware, but I think that’s comple…

Without some pretty strong UX like iOS this effort is not worth it. There is great UX in the FOSS world unfortunately.

Priorities sometimes differ :).

There is place in the market for reggae and death-metal.

You couldn't PAY me to take an iOS device as a main personal phone.

(although as a caveat: I might consider owning one to test cross-platform mobile applications)

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#89

Post by rocky1138 »

ekianjo wrote: post #73
rocky1138 wrote: post #48

I don't really have anything of value to add to the conversation, but in case the Librem5 team is here I just wanted to thank you for your work and applaud your openness to the current status of everything. Another project which is taking on a similar challenge and is similarly open is the Dragonbox Pyra.

> and is similarly open is the Dragonbox Pyra The Pyra is taking forever and it's pretty much a one-two men's team, which is why it takes so long I guess.

It is taking forever, yes. Unfortunate as the hardware will be out-of-date by the time it is actually fully released. Still, it'll be fast enough for its purposes and will really be a triumph for Michael Mrozek. It's amazing that he's been able to do all this.

Re: Librem5 Hardware Update

#90

Post by josteink »

djsumdog wrote: post #29
floatboth wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> crack the firmware In most cases, you don't have to crack anything, you can officially unlock the bootloader and flash your own OS build. Yes, you can't touch the early boot initialization, you're still required to use vendor blobs for using wireless/modem/camera/etc things, but you can control most of the software that matters.

Yea using adb/oemunlock. Sometimes you have to get a code (like with Sony, you input your IMEI number into their website and get one). I've had one Sony that was unlockable; a condition of the original cell provider. Still, it's bizarre considering you can install Linux on any PC/laptop you buy. The bigger issue of course, is that you can't just install Linux on a phone. They're all random pins soldered to random chi…

> Still, it's bizarre considering you can install Linux on any PC/laptop you buy.

Apple is trying to change that with their new T2-line of machines where you are effectively locked out of using the device’s storage if you try to boot a OS not blessed by Apple (like Linux).

You don’t own your new MacBook or Mac Mini.

https://www.phoronix.com/scan.php?page=news_item&px=Apple-T2...

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