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Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

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Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#81

Post by bilbo0s »

NeedMoreTea wrote: post #78
umeshunni wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a classic chicken and egg problem. Companies don't want to establish new offices in cities where they cannot attract new talent or there isn't a large existing base of talent. This limits large new offices to large metro areas (5M+ people) People don't want to relocate to cities where there aren't multiple job possibilities - you lose your job/hate it and don't want to have to relocate to find a new job or you w…

> Companies don't want to establish new offices in cities where they cannot attract new talent or there isn't a large existing base of talent This seems especially silly. There are almost limitless people who would like to get one of the FAANG co's on their CV. They'd gladly relocate and benefit from reasonable property prices for a year or three. Google or Netlix are hardly going to struggle to attract talent if the…

I don't know man?

You'd be surprised how attached people are to their spouses or partners. Doesn't matter how badly you want to work at Google, if your spouse is an IP attorney or VP at an academic hospital, as a family you just can't go moving to the middle of nowhere. It's not ALL about being able to work at Google. There's a lot more going on in making these decisions. (At least there is for the type of people that Google would be interested in.)

Much better to be in that NYC-Boston-DC corridor where high powered opportunities abound in multiple sectors. Or SF. Or Chicago. Etc. But trying to move a lot of these types of couples to, say, Lincoln Nebraska, is just asking for trouble. The spouses or partners are definitely not going to go for that.

Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#83

Post by tokyodude »

CydeWeys wrote: post #57
ArtWomb wrote: post #32

It's exciting. Google has been talking about expanding its presence forever. At least since purchasing the Chelsea Market complex. The Youtube studio is an amazing space. As is the AWS Loft downtown. Cornell Tech will have a new campus on Roosevelt Island. And Brooklyn has its New Lab / Navy Yards that is almost a tech city unto itself. It feels like there's community. And a multitude of events every day and night. W…

The nice thing about NYC in comparison to the Bay Area is that we're not afraid of building more housing here, so supply increases every year and has a dampening effect on rent increases. Also, mass transit is much better, so if you live even 30 minutes away on a subway line the rents will be much lower. If you're willing to commute an hour each way (which is still less than a lot of people who drive every day on I-1…

> and has a dampening effect on rent increase

Is that really true? I don't know if this data is accurate but googling "average rent new york city" vs "average rent san francisco" brings up these 2 results as the first hits. They look almost identical. The site claims average rent for NYC is $3634 vs SF at $3735. It also claims prices increased in NYC by 9.46% over last year vs SF at 0.62%

https://www.rentjungle.com/average-rent-in-san-francisco-ren...

https://www.rentjungle.com/average-rent-in-new-york-rent-tre...

Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#84

Post by tokyodude »

ndnxhs wrote: post #76
eloff wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're missing the point. It's a tough sell to relocate someone and give them a lower salary. Who'd take that deal?

People who understand the lower salary is easily made up for by lower living costs.

I'm not sure I'm convinced. To give an example a recruiter once tried to get me to move to some place in India (2002). He told me I'd be making $30k a year which was 10x what locals made so I'd be living like a king. Even if that was true that I could live like a king for that salary in India all I could think about is how I'd be stuck there because I'd have no money to leave to a more expensive place in the future.

Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#85

Post by dmoy »

tokyodude wrote: post #83
CydeWeys wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The nice thing about NYC in comparison to the Bay Area is that we're not afraid of building more housing here, so supply increases every year and has a dampening effect on rent increases. Also, mass transit is much better, so if you live even 30 minutes away on a subway line the rents will be much lower. If you're willing to commute an hour each way (which is still less than a lot of people who drive every day on I-1…

> and has a dampening effect on rent increase Is that really true? I don't know if this data is accurate but googling "average rent new york city" vs "average rent san francisco" brings up these 2 results as the first hits. They look almost identical. The site claims average rent for NYC is $3634 vs SF at $3735. It also claims prices increased in NYC by 9.46% over last year vs SF at 0.62% https://www.rentjungle.com/a…

The difference is a reasonable transit ride puts you in the radius of a staggeringly large amount of housing stock comparatively in NYC.

But, go to the SF burbs and try to find high rises... :/

Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#86

Post by nostrademons »

tokyodude wrote: post #83
CydeWeys wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The nice thing about NYC in comparison to the Bay Area is that we're not afraid of building more housing here, so supply increases every year and has a dampening effect on rent increases. Also, mass transit is much better, so if you live even 30 minutes away on a subway line the rents will be much lower. If you're willing to commute an hour each way (which is still less than a lot of people who drive every day on I-1…

> and has a dampening effect on rent increase Is that really true? I don't know if this data is accurate but googling "average rent new york city" vs "average rent san francisco" brings up these 2 results as the first hits. They look almost identical. The site claims average rent for NYC is $3634 vs SF at $3735. It also claims prices increased in NYC by 9.46% over last year vs SF at 0.62% https://www.rentjungle.com/a…

If NYC is currently at $3634 then yes, NYC has done much better than SF.

I remember getting out of college in 2005, hearing about the $3000+ 1BR apartments in NYC, and thinking "Why the hell would anyone want to move to NYC?" (I was living with my parents in Boston at the time, but looked at moving out and would've paid $650 with roommates or about $1100 for a 1BR in that city.) My now-wife was living in SF that same year and paid $1200 in rent.

The huge increases in SF rent happened mostly from 2010-2015. I paid $1400/month for a 1BR in 2009-2010 (Mountain View, not SF, but SF was still < $2000 at the time). By 2014 it was basically impossible to find something < $3000 in any transit-accessible part of the city, and apparently it's leveled off since.

Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#87

Post by toephu2 »

claydavisss wrote: post #33

Counterpoint: these jobs are increasingly meh and will not be impactful on the local economy. Lifetime comp (salary + retirement benefits) for Amazonians in Crystal City will probably be less than for comparable Federal workers. Google is like any other white collar business now - a small cadre of well paid execs surrounded by an army of people just doing ok. 80% of Googlers in NYC will probably have lower lifetime e…

You obviously have never gotten an offer from Google nor do you have any idea how much google pays software engineers.

I am not even going to waste my time making a rebuttal to your biased opinion.

Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#88

Post by toephu2 »

claydavisss wrote: post #47
akhilcacharya wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How much do you think Google NYC or even Amazon engineers make?

How much do you think a firefighter pulls in AFTER retiring? Most public employees with pensions will probably pull in well over a million after they retire and before they die. Tech workers are still young as a group so pension envy is still not a thing....but will be Run the numbers...tech jobs in a tier 1 real estate market isn't that great of a deal. Most likely a nice rental and a slightly underfunded 401k And d…

A young googler in his 20s easily pulls in over a million every 4 years...

Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#89

Post by C1sc0cat »

bilbo0s wrote: post #81
NeedMoreTea wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Companies don't want to establish new offices in cities where they cannot attract new talent or there isn't a large existing base of talent This seems especially silly. There are almost limitless people who would like to get one of the FAANG co's on their CV. They'd gladly relocate and benefit from reasonable property prices for a year or three. Google or Netlix are hardly going to struggle to attract talent if the…

I don't know man? You'd be surprised how attached people are to their spouses or partners. Doesn't matter how badly you want to work at Google, if your spouse is an IP attorney or VP at an academic hospital, as a family you just can't go moving to the middle of nowhere. It's not ALL about being able to work at Google. There's a lot more going on in making these decisions. (At least there is for the type of people tha…

And also for those with kids you have to think about them i.e. what opportunities will they have living in this area when they leave school.

Re: Google Plans Large New York City Expansion

#90

Post by nostrademons »

umeshunni wrote: post #16
taurath wrote: post #4

This coupled with the Amazon news is starting to get distressing. With the amount of companies that copycat them it’s like the rich are getting richer and the economic benefits are still going to be concentrated only in the most affluent cities. The rest of the country desperately needs real industry and good paying jobs - and will go to huge lengths to try to get them but it appears nobody can come up with a busines…

It's a classic chicken and egg problem. Companies don't want to establish new offices in cities where they cannot attract new talent or there isn't a large existing base of talent. This limits large new offices to large metro areas (5M+ people) People don't want to relocate to cities where there aren't multiple job possibilities - you lose your job/hate it and don't want to have to relocate to find a new job or you w…

"Things that can happen that could break this cycle include"

Also: universities, new natural resource discoveries, natural disasters, different regulatory environments, developments in transportation.

I have a hunch that the North Coast of Canada is going to become a huge boom town within my lifetime, but it's likely to take a couple decades, and I don't yet know where the major cities will be. Am tempted to take a Northwest Passage cruise to find out, though.

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