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Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

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Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#81

Post by shortoncash »

jurassic wrote: post #4

I think this is getting upvoted because everybody likes to dogpile on Amazon. But nothing this guy says seems to reflect especially poorly on Amazon. If the author is going through another job search now I might recommend taking the piece down; it's not doing you a ton of favors. The summary: guy interviews and accepts an SDE1 role at Amazon, guy resists building alliances with those holding power in the org, guy is…

I somewhat agree with this comment, but I don't want him to take his article down. I really hope people out there manage their expectations and come to terms with reality by matching up their experiences with this guy's experiences, followed by reading comments like yours on HN.

I hope the net isn't too harsh on this guy for being honest.

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#82

Post by [deleted] »

Pfhreak wrote: post #9

I was super happy with Amazon for 6 years or so. Compensated well, worked hard but fairly (and rarely more than 40-45 hours a week), great peers, good managers, and plenty of interesting work to do. I eventually left because Amazon restricted building games in my spare time with my friends. I just wanted to jam on the weekends on something that would never ship as a creative outlet. Turns out they have a policy that…

[deleted]

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#83

Post by agoldis »

filmgirlcw wrote: post #78

My biggest takeaway from reading this isn’t that Amazon is a bad place to work — but that it was the wrong place for the author to work. To me the biggest red flag was the fact that the role/team wasn’t discussed until AFTER the interview was over. Maybe that’s common with hiring events — I work at Microsoft but I’ll be the first to admit I’m very OOTL when it comes to recruitment efforts outside of my team/org. In a…

I read your comment and I'd say you are completely right.

The hiring event is sponsored by Amazon's divisions, it's a massive recruitment - like, we need 30 new developers - go end get em. There was no single person from the actual team I was working for at the interviews.

After I passed the interviews, I was told that they still don't know about the specific job because organizing the paperwork for relocation would take few months, until then many things can change.

As soon as papers arrived I insisted to talk to my future manager (I verified after I started that I was the only person who did that - other people were just assigned a position within a team). It was too late thought - I was already committed to move.

I do take responsibility setting wrong expectations, and as you pointed out (and the article states) it is my experience and observations of what happened.

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#84

Post by daxfohl »

My one advice is don't take a job that you think is below your qualifications. Don't even apply for them. Because now you're stuck with SDE1 on your resume after ten years of experience. That makes it look like you must not be very competent at what you do. It's always better to hold out for a higher position. If enough time goes by with no bites then maybe reduce your expectations. But shoot high and don't worry about rejection. And definitely don't worry about getting in over your head. If you're competent you'll be fine wherever you land. If not, well you won't be the first person in the world who has been underqualified at their job. But the future opportunities will be greater with the bigger role on your resume.

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#85

Post by Epskampie »

shortoncash wrote: post #81
jurassic wrote: post #4

I think this is getting upvoted because everybody likes to dogpile on Amazon. But nothing this guy says seems to reflect especially poorly on Amazon. If the author is going through another job search now I might recommend taking the piece down; it's not doing you a ton of favors. The summary: guy interviews and accepts an SDE1 role at Amazon, guy resists building alliances with those holding power in the org, guy is…

I somewhat agree with this comment, but I don't want him to take his article down. I really hope people out there manage their expectations and come to terms with reality by matching up their experiences with this guy's experiences, followed by reading comments like yours on HN. I hope the net isn't too harsh on this guy for being honest.

Agreed, I enjoyed reading it because it’s honest and non-dramatic. Seems like the average experience a tech can expect in big corp land.

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#86

Post by kilroy123 »

NAHWheatCracker wrote: post #52
kilroy123 wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wow your comment really made me think. I too have been in the industry for over a decade. Thinking back, I can not think of a single manager or lead that I wanted to be like, as well. In fact, because of my last horrible manager, the worst I've ever had, I want to exit the industry all together. I just want to go my own way and have my own small business.

In fact, because of my last horrible manager, the worst I've ever had, I want to exit the industry all together. I consider myself lucky to never had a truly horrible manager. I just want to go my own way and have my own small business. If only it were so easy.

You're telling me! Software engineer != Entrepreneur

It's been a brutal run so far. I'm failing at it and it's hard not to tie your self-esteem and self worth to it all.

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#87

Post by lsc »

philliphaydon wrote: post #29
lilyball wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone with 10 years of experience getting offered an SDE1 role is a huge red flag for me and makes me wonder what this person's skill set actually is.

I'm willing to bet if I interviewed at Amazon (or Google/MS/FB/Uber) I would probably be put in a similar role, despite having been programming since I was 8 with 14 years of commercial experience. I never went to Uni and have no degree.

Eh, as a datapoint, I also have no degree. I worked at google for a few years as a contractor (with 15+ years industry experience before that) - A few months back, I interviewed and was hired on as a L4 (L3, as I understand it, is where you come in after college, L5 is senior.)

My personal impression is that it was pretty clear to all involved what they'd need to pay me, and they slotted me in at a tech level that made that ask reasonable.

(but then, I think that ask really was reasonable for my skill level and the current market, if anything in this market can be seen as reasonable, so I guess in the end, that means the same thing as slotting in my level based on my skill level. But google and the contracting house both had a lot of information about what I was willing to accept, and about what other companies were willing to offer me. I have a very open negotiating style.)

My other impression is that I totally would have had that senior title at a smaller company, but I wouldn't have gotten paid any more, so again, the money seems to be the honest signal.

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#88

Post by agoldis »

ti_ranger wrote: post #68
agoldis wrote: post #18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks for pointing that out! I was frustrated by the expectation to focus on documenting to get a promotion. I don't think it is a good practice and was surprised to see that: > focusing on that process (promotion) is not a distraction from doing your job: it is doing your job! Seems like you understanding of "doing job" is different. To make it clear - I used to be promoted by helping a business grow - complete act…

> I was frustrated by the expectation to focus on documenting to get a promotion. I don't think it is a good practice and was surprised to see that: This was apparently a relatively recent change. Until about a year ago, apparently managers wrote this document. Previous feedback that the promotion process seemed random, obscure, and allowed favoritism resulted in this change being made, where employees are involved i…

Thanks for investing your time and writing this comment - it all makes sense! Keep in mind, that it was just a part of my overall experience at Amazon, and the experience is my personal :)

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#89

Post by ap3 »

cblum wrote: post #67
NAHWheatCracker wrote: post #17

This was the least convincing blog post on this sort of topic that I've read. I didn't see anything that actually painted Amazon in a very bad light. I think anyone should expect bureaucracy to be a major problem at a large company. Complaining about promotions seems a bit unfair since he was only there for 5 months. Moreover, I saw quite a few senior engineers and discovered that I do not want to be alike… This is o…

I thought the part where they offered him an SDE I position despite his 10 years of experience was pretty bad. It does seem like standard policy among tech companies though. I came to the US to work for Microsoft (I'm no longer there) as a level 59 (lowest SDE level), despite having almost 6 years of experience at that point. My wife (an SDET) had even more experience than me (she was a Senior SDET before we moved he…

Why did you accept a lower level position?

How long did it take you to get promoted back to your level ?

Re: Quitting Amazon 5 months after I started

#90

Post by ap3 »

agoldis wrote: post #45
lilyball wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Someone with 10 years of experience getting offered an SDE1 role is a huge red flag for me and makes me wonder what this person's skill set actually is.

I worked at IT department of Intel for 6 years. Then for about a year as a DevOps. Then for 3 years as JS developer at a startup. Plus few open source contributions and side projects. I wasn't strong in Java or other fundamental languages. == That is my skillset

Thanks for the article

How many years of SDE experience do you say you have?

Not sure I would would count devops or IT though

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