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I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

triplebyte.com

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Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have been doing mysql database type things for 15 years solid. Once during a job interview at digg.com, someone [ok ok doxx removed] asked: "what is a having statement in sql?". I jumped in explained how you can filter aggregated sets performed by a 'group by' and rambled on and on. He stopped me and said, "You can use a having statement without a group by, are you sure you know how they work." I have never seen th…

[No longer applicable]

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Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#82
post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Isn't a lot of the job of software engineering to quickly and concisely communicate complicated concepts? Might this actually be an accurate work sample? How else might you measure something like this? Also the next few lines kinda address what you are saying: > It also might be that they know them inside-and-out but aren’t used to answering questions on the fly, or that our question didn’t use the vocabulary they’re…

>Isn't a lot of the job of software engineering to quickly and concisely communicate complicated concepts? No, I write code daily but I might have to distill down technical concepts once a week or so (usually not even that much) and even then if I happen to be the only one who can distill it down. If your devs are often explaining basic stuff like 'what is a relational database?', you need to hire someone specificall…

If you can't concisely communicate complicated concepts, you're creating technical debt every time you hand off a project.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#83
I'm going to go against the grain and say that interview feedback is overrated (at least for senior people). If you got offered the job, then there's your feedback. If not, the interviewing company isn't going to tell you any more than you could already discern yourself by playing back your answers and conversations with the interviewers. If you honestly feel you aced the interview, then other factors are in play - perhaps they realized they are overstaffed, layoffs are imminent/hiring freezes, or just a slightly better and more personable candidate came along.

One time I interviewed for a position that I wanted badly. I studied and prepped for the interview, then during the interview I nailed every question. I waited a week but never heard back. After a few weeks of silence and giving up hope, I searched the company on LinkedIn, and found the person they hired for the position. It turns out he had more backend experience, which is what they were looking for. It was a painful truth, but them sending me a rejection email telling me this wouldn't have helped me at all.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#84
post #2

Article author - I'm on the writing team at Triplebyte. Most of what we do is summarize candidates' technical performance for their introduction to companies, but we also send feedback to everyone who takes our two-hour interview. I took this responsibility over from our first engineer, who built a bunch of software to make the process faster - it lets me quickly autogenerate emails by clicking all the resources I wa…

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Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#85
post #40

When someone can’t answer an interview question about relational databases, it might be that they don’t know anything about relational databases. I thought you all were better than this. Why are you asking questions about relational databases? Why not just have candidates accomplish the thing you're assessing with an actual relational database ? I know you're work-sample-literate! But if your feedback emphasizes comm…

> Why are you asking questions about relational databases?

Why wouldn't you ask questions about relational databases? I would expect any decent dev to know the fundamentals of relational databases.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#86

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Isn't a lot of the job of software engineering to quickly and concisely communicate complicated concepts? No, I write code daily but I might have to distill down technical concepts once a week or so (usually not even that much) and even then if I happen to be the only one who can distill it down. If your devs are often explaining basic stuff like 'what is a relational database?', you need to hire someone specificall…

If your devs are often explaining basic stuff like 'what is a relational database?', you need to hire someone specifically to do that. It's not a good use of time especially when they can go google/wikipedia those concepts and figure it out themselves. If you can’t communicate ideas and basic concepts to non technical people, you will both limit your career opportunities and not be able to get your ideas implemented…

If they come to me for basic stuff, I tell them to go research it on their own. I'm not going to regurgitate wikipedia if they haven't put in some effort.

At some point, we need to start demanding basic technical competence from the people around software developers.

Otherwise, people will just be interrupting you all day and how much have we collectively written about that problem?

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#87
post #40

When someone can’t answer an interview question about relational databases, it might be that they don’t know anything about relational databases. I thought you all were better than this. Why are you asking questions about relational databases? Why not just have candidates accomplish the thing you're assessing with an actual relational database ? I know you're work-sample-literate! But if your feedback emphasizes comm…

Imagine a junior developer asking your senior developer a question about how a relational database does something. There you go, now it's a work-sample for your senior developer.

I suspect a lot of my feeling of whether these people are good or crazy comes down to whether they can contextualize their questions. Most of the questions I get asked are for code I would veto in a PR because there are battle tested alternatives.

I’ve been trying to do something about that when it’s my turn to ask interview questions. For instance, too many front end people struggle with basic data manipulation workflows. I want to virtue signal that it’s better to move this kind of logic to the backend, but I need to test them anyway.

So I create a plausible scenario, maybe this is a POC to see if it’s worth sort or grouping functionality to the backend.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#88
post #40

When someone can’t answer an interview question about relational databases, it might be that they don’t know anything about relational databases. I thought you all were better than this. Why are you asking questions about relational databases? Why not just have candidates accomplish the thing you're assessing with an actual relational database ? I know you're work-sample-literate! But if your feedback emphasizes comm…

> Why are you asking questions about relational databases? Why wouldn't you ask questions about relational databases? I would expect any decent dev to know the fundamentals of relational databases.

I think you're missing my point. Qualifying candidates based on relational database skill is not a problem; if it's something they'll be expected to do on the job, you should evaluate their ability. I'm saying the kind of Socratic interview alluded to in this article isn't the best way to accomplish that.

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#89
post #83

I'm going to go against the grain and say that interview feedback is overrated (at least for senior people). If you got offered the job, then there's your feedback. If not, the interviewing company isn't going to tell you any more than you could already discern yourself by playing back your answers and conversations with the interviewers. If you honestly feel you aced the interview, then other factors are in play - p…

An email would've at least saved your time spent in LinkedIn search. And what if the new employee wasn't on LinkedIn?

Re: I know why rejection emails suck – I write them

#90

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Isn't a lot of the job of software engineering to quickly and concisely communicate complicated concepts? No, I write code daily but I might have to distill down technical concepts once a week or so (usually not even that much) and even then if I happen to be the only one who can distill it down. If your devs are often explaining basic stuff like 'what is a relational database?', you need to hire someone specificall…

If you can't concisely communicate complicated concepts, you're creating technical debt every time you hand off a project.

If you come to me for basic stuff every time without effort on your own part, you're not likely a good fit for the team.
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