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Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

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Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#81

Post by Osiris »

omot wrote: post #34

Just thought to leave an aside for anyone considering working in Utah. I Lived in Orem, Utah for a long-time super interesting state. Everyone is super conservative, no doubt, but they are the nicest people I've ever met. They can be "accidentally" racist and bigoted but I attribute that for their ignorance as opposed to hate. The church itself governs and operates like a socialist country. Every church member in the…

I've been Mormon my whole life and Utah still feels weird to me. The culture is definitely influenced by the Church, but the culture is distinctly "Utahn". Go meet some Mormons in California, New York, or out of the country, and you'll see the difference.

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#82

Post by tallanvor »

david-cako wrote: post #21
Mbioguy wrote: post #6

A deeply red/Republican and relatively low-density state might seem like a strange place to find a functional public transit system. Utah is an interesting place. The geography of the Wasatch Front lends itself to public transit in ways that less geographically-constrained places do not. The region is mostly a north-south corridor, with occasional off-shoots to the side, which is how the transit network has developed…

Mormons are the kindest and hardest working people in the country. They understand taking care of each other in ways no one else seems to, and I think that is most of the reason why Utah is so functional. Christians that actually act what they speak in nearly every way. An aside, smog is really bad in Salt Lake due to its geography and that is probably one of the reasons they are taking this so seriously.

> Mormons are the kindest

There is nothing kind about their treatment of the LGBT population in general, and LGBT youth in particular.

And if they were really that good at taking care of each other, I don't think that Utah would rank 5th in the nation for adolescent suicides (children 15 - 19 years) with a per capita suicide rate more than double the national average.*

They really do like to put on a good face, but their actions and the data says something rather different.

* https://www.statista.com/statistics/666791/states-with-highe...

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#83

Post by kennydude »

modells wrote: post #31

It often takes 2 hours to get by bus or light-rail from one end of Santa Clara county to the other, while driving typically takes an average of 20-25 minutes. Also, VTA is expensive for low-income folks with a minimum of $2 for a single ride, and it takes up to 4-5 rides to get somewhere each way , and so the daily passes are $7.. Which is also a lot. Yearly passes for kids and disabled are $330, $880 for adults and…

Sounds like they need a "hopper" system like London has. London, weirdly, has the cheapest bus system in the UK.

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#84

Post by mholt »

So, I live in a BRT neighborhood in Provo, and it's really weird. It's more inconvenient for motorists, the bike routes are awkward (there are new signs for bikes to yield to vehicles -- at an intersection that has a median through it and is solely for the benefit of bicyclists), and pedestrians have to go into the middle of the street to get on the bus. And BRT still takes 1.5x-2x the time to get to main destinations than direct car routes do.

Not to mention that one of the residential BRT streets north of me has been under construction for more time than it took NASA to get to the moon in the '60s.

But it's cool that we get free service, I guess. BYU and UVU students get free UTA transportation (more than just BRT) with their ID cards.

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#85

Post by hueving »

Mbioguy wrote: post #6

A deeply red/Republican and relatively low-density state might seem like a strange place to find a functional public transit system. Utah is an interesting place. The geography of the Wasatch Front lends itself to public transit in ways that less geographically-constrained places do not. The region is mostly a north-south corridor, with occasional off-shoots to the side, which is how the transit network has developed…

>A deeply red/Republican and relatively low-density state might seem like a strange place to find a functional public transit system.

Only if you buy the strawmen of politics in the US of there being two 'sides' with everyone neatly falling into place on a pathetic line.

The further you get away from the shithole that is the US federal government, the more this becomes apparent. The things each 'side' is supposed to support completely changes at the state levels and varies from state to state.

The best thing you can do is dispose of the notion of a single political spectrum and you will be a lot less shocked when you encounter something contrary to the propaganda designed to divide people.

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#86

Post by mholt »

vlunkr wrote: post #37
david-cako wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Mormons are the kindest and hardest working people in the country. They understand taking care of each other in ways no one else seems to, and I think that is most of the reason why Utah is so functional. Christians that actually act what they speak in nearly every way. An aside, smog is really bad in Salt Lake due to its geography and that is probably one of the reasons they are taking this so seriously.

I’m happy to see so many positive comments about Mormons here. I usually don’t mention that I’m Mormon in online forums since I see mostly negativity about the church. (It’s just me being self-conscious) We’re certainly not perfect but we do try to look out our neighbors, I’m glad that’s recognized on the outside as well.

Thanks for writing this -- I'm in the same boat. I'm not obvious about it (except maybe a mention in my Twitter bio or an occasional tweet) because I feel like mentioning my faith will taint people's perspective of me or my work. I am hopeful that there are quite a few people who can respect Mormons even if they don't agree with the tenets of the LDS church.

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#87

Post by nikanj »

MaysonL wrote: post #72
krapp wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A cult is nothing more than an unpopular religion. Christianity itself was just a Jewish cult until Constantine found it useful.

Best definition of cult I've heard of: a religion the majority of whose members weren't born into the religion.

In a cult, there is a person on the top who knows it’s all fake. In a religion, that person has already passed away.

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#88

Post by hueving »

matthewwiese wrote: post #63
dredmorbius wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are a number of other features generally included in the definition of cults. Isolation, absolute authority, leader-worship, shunning of defectors, and other elements among them. https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Cult#Warning_signs_of_a_potent...

I agree with you that it's uncharitable to call Christianity a cult when there are more obviously perverse religious/New Age groups that better align with the definition (at least for the sake of debate). However, I'm sure if you asked an LGBTQ person of their experiences with Christianity, especially with the uniquely conservative U.S. evangelical variety, they would say that some of those qualities clearly fit the…

I'm not aware of shunning people being common in US Christian groups for leaving. I stopped going to a church long ago and still keep in touch with friends who still attend.

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#89

Post by jlebar »

mikeyouse wrote: post #74
xeromal wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tolls should be raised until a lower amount of cars are around

Which is an efficient economic solution that basically ignores that we have a terrible public transit system and pervasive inequality which would result in the tolls being primarily on the backs of the poorest among us who travel the furthest to work in City centers to be paid the least.

So use the surplus to lower taxes on poor folks?

Like, you can't fight the laws of economics. We don't have to like them, but can't we work within them rather than coming up with economically inefficient solutions which are bad for everyone?

Re: Utah expands public transportation with rapid bus transit, free until 2021

#90

Post by bobthepanda »

mikeyouse wrote: post #74
xeromal wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The tolls should be raised until a lower amount of cars are around

Which is an efficient economic solution that basically ignores that we have a terrible public transit system and pervasive inequality which would result in the tolls being primarily on the backs of the poorest among us who travel the furthest to work in City centers to be paid the least.

If you read the article I linked, they raised the tolls and used the money to pay for more frequent bus services, and those bus services also ran faster due to the tolls decreasing congestion. So in the end it was pretty equitable given that higher tolls directly funded public transit improvements.
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