WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook • Hacker News Board

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#81

Post by criddell » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:38 AM UTC

yters wrote: post #68

HenryBemis wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Google absolutely harvests all info they can get. They scan gmails, they monitorig everything on all Android phones, even when you disable something [1]. It's just that Google maybe be a bit hesitant to sell data to 3rd parties, since they abuse them themselves :) (and this is the price of a 'free' service). [1]: https://gadgets.ndtv.com/apps/news/google-tracking-user-loca...

Arguably Google can create a pretty good social network from email. That's why the use it for ads.

I was looking at Google Plus again last week and there's a lot of interesting things about it. I kind of wish they would spin it off into its own company.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#82

Post by skybrian » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:42 AM UTC

4684499 wrote: post #67

skybrian wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do you know Google does the same thing? What can you get out of Google by writing an app? Off the top of my head, I don't think Google even has most people's friends lists (outside Orkut back in the day, and Google+, which isn't so popular). They do have contact lists in Gmail, which is a bit different. There is address book spamming via mobile apps, but again, there are permissions. How good are they? It seems l…

You are implying friends list is the main factor here. Let's assume you are right. Still, Google may have a database for people you might know, you just don't know its existence yet. They don't have to let you input your contacts voluntarily to find out about your relationships. For example, have you used Google Maps? You search a place, Google tells you popular time of that place, how did they get the data? If they…

So you're saying they have lots of personal data (nobody is disputing this). If they have the data, and they let someone else have access to it, it could leak. Which, sure, makes sense.

But that's not the same as "know[ing] Google does the same thing" unless you define either "know" or "the same thing" very loosely.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#83

Post by criddell » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:43 AM UTC

axd wrote: post #77

If this isn't the opportunity for Diaspora* to become a thing in the public's mind, I don't know what is. We have to use this in order to move to a better platform for social media.

Diaspora is a non-starter.

Look at their getting started page. Step one - choose a pod. You just lost 90% of the people that might be interested. They need to get rid of that step.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#84

Post by criddell » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:44 AM UTC

bassman9000 wrote: post #55

odammit wrote: post #42

Will deleting Facebook actually remove your data though? I’ve deleted mine a few times and then inevitably have had to use OAuth for some random site I’d auth’d to and lo-and-behold it works and all my data is back. Last time I went through that flow was maybe a year ago. I always assumed they did some sort of paranoid delete or “anonymized” the data.

Nope The only way to win is not to play

I think it actually does delete your data now. They added that in response to upcoming GDPR regulations.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#85

Post by odammit » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:44 AM UTC

rdtsc wrote: post #76

odammit wrote: post #42

Will deleting Facebook actually remove your data though? I’ve deleted mine a few times and then inevitably have had to use OAuth for some random site I’d auth’d to and lo-and-behold it works and all my data is back. Last time I went through that flow was maybe a year ago. I always assumed they did some sort of paranoid delete or “anonymized” the data.

I never signed up for it and they probably have a profile on me simply because of the connections to people who have FB. That always creeped me out. Wonder if there is something in the GDPR legislation to get all the info they have on me and make them erase it.

I only originally signed up because I was single and dating and girls found it “creepy” I didnt have a Facebook.

Peer pressure, man.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#86

Post by fareesh » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:46 AM UTC

Despite the barrage of negative stories that would have ended nearly every other Presidential campaign - ranging from accusations of racism, misogyny, treason, incompetence, mental instability - despite all of it, tens of millions of Americans absolutely love President Trump.

I cannot imagine how utterly frustrating it must be for them to watch the media bounce from story after story in some convoluted attempt to explain why they voted the way they did - from Russian hacking to white supremacy to Facebook ads to Facebook data. This is just one more in a long line of justifications when the most likely reasonable explanation is that he is beloved by millions, not just in the USA but around the world.

The same goes for Brexit.

"Your side won because the Russians and this data company and Facebook made you vote that way. We're going to make sure this never happens again!"

It's unfortunate that in the aftermath of polarizing and controversial decisions like these, this kind of rhetoric will now drive people further apart, because one side refuses to accept the reality of the other's opinions, and dismisses them with conspiracy theories.

Today people are pretending to be shocked that Facebook shares data with apps through the developer API. Most of the permissions being talked about were removed a long time ago. What is happening now is basically vindictive hatred for Facebook from the tens of millions who feel wronged and cheated by electoral results that they lost fair and square.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#87

Post by jiggliemon » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:47 AM UTC

All of this Facebook hubub and broad public outcry is really all owed to the election of Trump. If Trump handnt leveraged CA, we’d still all be happy and fat on out individual bliss boxes – patting ourselves on the back – because our side [a la Obama] was smart enough to use this technology to our advantage.

Now when the enemy has (and use) the same technology, we’re forced to cry foul. Demand oversight. Demand regulation.

The greater public is OK with this technology. They’re Ok with sweeping data collection (Snowden Files). They’re OK with mining personal data (Facebook, Google, etc). Thy’re OK with 1984, so long as it’s their sides version of 1984.

It takes a Trump for your side to realize how shitty things got while you were enamored with charisma on your bliss box.

Edit: typing on my phone. Fixing grammar.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#88

Post by paulcole » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:47 AM UTC

apotheothesomai wrote: post #63

iliketosleep wrote: post #31

It's quite ironic that this is the man who sold WhatsApp and its enormous userbase to facebook, creating a total lock in to the facebook ecosystem for many who do not even use facebook. He would have known what kind of a company facebook is, so I don't understand the contradiction between selling Whatsapp to them and now caring about these issues. Anyway, I am still glad he's getting behind the #deletefacebook moveme…

Jan's commitment to privacy motivated WhatsApp. Jan and Acton always have believed in it strongly. That said, if your company has 50 people, and FB offers nearly $20B. How exactly do you tell those people that you refused an acquisition that huge, because you personally feel that FB is bad. Could you deprive an engineer who has worked his ass off for 4 years >$100M? Anyway, I was contracting for WhatsApp, when the ac…

So you’re saying they believed in privacy strongly but believed in getting rich more. Got it.

Nothing wrong with that. I’d do the same.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#89

Post by mysterypie » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:47 AM UTC

walrus01 wrote: post #49

justboxing wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We've knows Facebook tracks everything Not disputing this, but when you say 'we' I think you mean the The rest 95% either don't know, or could care less even if they know. I've told my non-techie fam and friends about data harvesting, privacy, and how facebook tracks everything, only to be ignored or outright ridiculed ("Oh you techies are so paranoid"). Many of my friends in India (where I was raised) and elsewher…

> The rest 95% either don't know, or could care less even if they know. I've told my non-techie fam and friends about data harvesting, privacy, and how facebook tracks everything, only to be ignored or outright ridiculed ("Oh you techies are so paranoid"). pretty much exactly my experience with Canadian and American family. People didn't give one iota of a fuck when the Snowden revelations came out because they just…

> People didn't give one iota of a fuck when the Snowden revelations came out because they just assumed that it was the case already.

It's more complex than that. The tracking and surveillance are not visible to the average person. Point your camera at someone in a coffee shop or bar and take their picture. They'll be coming over to ask you why you took their photo. The fact that the coffee shop or bar is brimming with overhead cameras is completely lost on them because it is mostly invisible (or least no longer noticed).

Just wait until someone does a massive leak of actual personal data, photos, and videos, as opposed to abstract technical reports and Powerpoint slides that Snowden leaked. The average person will be screaming like a banshee when they can look up all the personal info and private pics of themselves and their neighbors and friends on some public webserver.

Re: WhatsApp co-founder tells everyone to delete Facebook

#90

Post by scrumper » Wed, Mar 21, 2018, 2:50 AM UTC

fareesh wrote: post #86

Despite the barrage of negative stories that would have ended nearly every other Presidential campaign - ranging from accusations of racism, misogyny, treason, incompetence, mental instability - despite all of it, tens of millions of Americans absolutely love President Trump. I cannot imagine how utterly frustrating it must be for them to watch the media bounce from story after story in some convoluted attempt to exp…

> What is happening now is basically vindictive hatred for Facebook from the tens of millions who feel wronged and cheated by electoral results that they lost fair and square.

I'm not saying that's not part of it, but it's only part of it. There's plenty of other bad stuff about Facebook that people don't like: children experiencing isolation and depression; cyberbullying; addiction; shallow, empty interactions; clickbait mental junk food replacing content from actual friends... It goes on.