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Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

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Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#81

Post by ryandrake »

overcast wrote: post #77
pmorici wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

150k sounds way low for the Bay Area you can get that in other much less expensive metro areas.

No way on this earth, $150,000 is anywhere near normal in the Bay Area, let alone in other less expensive metros. Most people are absolutely not making that much money writing code. People have serious tunnel vision on HN.

I'm tired of posting and re-posting the links, but according to Glassdoor and Salary.com, median software engineer salary in the bay area is around ~110K. You can criticize the online source but at least it's a data point besides "I totally know a guy working at BigCorp who makes $200K"

EDIT:

Friends, this is what happens when you post before coffee. As ams6110 points out I'm in violent agreement with the person I'm rebutting. Should have stayed in bed.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#82

Post by mgc092 »

tudorw wrote: post #26
mgc092 wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I guess 100% (doubling it), since he wrote that he was cutting it in half before

have you thought about a career in software development ?

My response may sound stupid, but the question asked how much the increase in percentage was... So I just answered the question.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#83

Post by pc86 »

leecarraher wrote: post #75

I agree that many companies should pay more competitive salaries , but doesn't this disproportionately hurt people in higher cost of living areas? Everyone else gets a pay increase, the company's bottom line tightens, and higher cost of living area folks get nothing for it. I live in an area with a relatively low cost of living, and the only way I would consider moving elsewhere would be if the salary were increased…

One of the reasons I can never work in the bay area. I'd need somewhere between $300k and $400k cash comp a year to maintain an equal QOL, due mainly to the cheap housing in my area. That's simply not attainable with my skillset, which is much closer to CRUD/line-of-business applications than senior infrastructure at Netflix or anything else that would pull that level of compensation.

To me, this is a good move. As work becomes more remote, living in the super expensive urban areas is a choice that has a price associated with it. Everyone benefits when that choice isn't constrained by the need to be there so you can commute 2 hours into a cube farm.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#84

Post by ams6110 »

ryandrake wrote: post #81
overcast wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No way on this earth, $150,000 is anywhere near normal in the Bay Area, let alone in other less expensive metros. Most people are absolutely not making that much money writing code. People have serious tunnel vision on HN.

I'm tired of posting and re-posting the links, but according to Glassdoor and Salary.com, median software engineer salary in the bay area is around ~110K. You can criticize the online source but at least it's a data point besides "I totally know a guy working at BigCorp who makes $200K" EDIT: Friends, this is what happens when you post before coffee. As ams6110 points out I'm in violent agreement with the person I'm…

I think you're agreeing with GP? He's saying people are not making that much.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#85

Post by BoorishBears »

overcast wrote: post #77
pmorici wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

150k sounds way low for the Bay Area you can get that in other much less expensive metro areas.

No way on this earth, $150,000 is anywhere near normal in the Bay Area, let alone in other less expensive metros. Most people are absolutely not making that much money writing code. People have serious tunnel vision on HN.

I think at some point it comes down to skill of talent too.

Most locales also have companies that know that the best talent can go to the Bay Area and make $150,000 and much more, so they offer salaries that are way above normal for the area, but competitive to Bay Area salaries.

But if you’re not on that side of the talent scale (or not perceived as being on that side of it), your salary ends up being in line with your locales average salary across multiple industries for “mid level job requiring a bachelors degree”

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#86

Post by 31reasons »

TomMarius wrote: post #32
czechdeveloper wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EDIT: This comment was incorrect and I do not wish for more down votes. ORIGINAL: I believe it should be about 100 USD/hour for skilled consultant, but maybe someone with more experience can correct that.

For employment yes, consultant or contractor (which you probably will be if you're remote) can make double or more. 100 USD/hour is Prague, Czech Republic-level rate for a skilled consultant.

Depends on what contracting work you are doing. The average web/mobile dev can't charge that much anywhere in the US. Company that I work for itself (an app dev company) does not charge more than $120/hour/dev to their SF clients.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#87

Post by overcast »

ryandrake wrote: post #81
overcast wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No way on this earth, $150,000 is anywhere near normal in the Bay Area, let alone in other less expensive metros. Most people are absolutely not making that much money writing code. People have serious tunnel vision on HN.

I'm tired of posting and re-posting the links, but according to Glassdoor and Salary.com, median software engineer salary in the bay area is around ~110K. You can criticize the online source but at least it's a data point besides "I totally know a guy working at BigCorp who makes $200K" EDIT: Friends, this is what happens when you post before coffee. As ams6110 points out I'm in violent agreement with the person I'm…

Right, so at the very least half are making less than $110,000 which is $40,000 less than the "everyone is making $150,000" in all major cities. There are a small percentage making a ton of money, and most making normal sub six figure salaries.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#88

Post by overcast »

BoorishBears wrote: post #85
overcast wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No way on this earth, $150,000 is anywhere near normal in the Bay Area, let alone in other less expensive metros. Most people are absolutely not making that much money writing code. People have serious tunnel vision on HN.

I think at some point it comes down to skill of talent too. Most locales also have companies that know that the best talent can go to the Bay Area and make $150,000 and much more, so they offer salaries that are way above normal for the area, but competitive to Bay Area salaries. But if you’re not on that side of the talent scale (or not perceived as being on that side of it), your salary ends up being in line with y…

Sure, but every single person going to the Bay Area isn't the "best talent", that's just not even realistic. So yes, talent demands big bucks, but it's still a bell curve, and that peak is below $150,000

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#89

Post by coding123 »

Veen wrote: post #66
cpursley wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

None, due to the glare and distractions. The real work gets done back at hotel/airbnb/coliving/coworking.

This was my experience. When I was a digital nomad my workdays were just spent in a variety of airbnbs instead of my home office. I did spend two weeks working on a beach in Cadiz, but I found that either I was too focused on the work to enjoy the beach or too focused on the surroundings to be productive.

My fav remote work is on top of a mountain looking down at a town, which is less crazy than a beach and work gets done in more of a zen like setting.

Re: Basecamp doesn’t employ anyone in SF, but now we pay everyone as though all did

#90

Post by flexie »

cpursley wrote: post #58
flexie wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Basecamp is selling all over the world. What should their salary level be like? Bay Area because that’s where a lot of the larger tech companies are situated? Washington State (Microsoft, Amazon)? Copenhagen (where one founder, DHH is from)? Sudney where one major competitor, Jira, is from? I’d say whatever the market is that they hire in. If you wanna pay above market rate, by all means do that. If you can attract e…

Because all companies are competing with Bay Area companies when it comes to recruiting.

It's really not true. I'd say that it's more Silicon Valley recruiting all over America, than the rest of the US trying to recruit in Silicon Valley. And even if they did, they don't need to pay SV salaries to compete. Salaries adjusted for taxes and living costs is what matters, and other perks such as the City, family friendly areas etc matter too.

And worldwide, Silicon Valley is probably less than 1 percent of all tech hires and less than 10 percent of the top hires. Silicon Valley takes an impressive amount of the top talents for its size, but not most, and almost certainly a decreasing amount. The world is large, and by far the most talents couldn't even get a visa for the US if Google or Apple wanted them.

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