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Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

theguardian.com

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Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#81

Post by bitexploder »

knrz wrote: post #53
grondilu wrote: post #4

Lately I've become more and more convinced that indeed, modern society sucks, or at the very least that I, and people like me, am not well equipped to flourish in it. I'm sure some people are though, but I suspect they are becoming the minority. Few days ago I also read Ted Kaczynski's essay[1], and it's hard for me not to acknowledge how right he is on many points. However, I do believe it is possible to survive all…

I have a theory about stoicism in the past vs. stoicism in the present. Keep in mind that I say this all from a very North American point of view (born in Iran, but grew up in Canada). In the past, there was no guard against disease. If it came, you were done for. There were some limited options available when it came to medicine, but by and large, if you got a disease, that was it. It was out of your hands, and even…

Stoicism addresses deeply rooted human tendencies. I don't think, if we are being honest, we have any more real control. We are less likely to die but we have merely stretched our individual timeline slightly in the scheme of things. It (access to modern medicine) should not change ones philosophy much IMO.

Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#82

Post by goldfeld »

1_player wrote: post #71
madaxe_again wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s also possible to live differently. I played the stoic for decades until the isolation of being a business owner living in a city pushed me over the brink. I’ve struggled with loneliness my entire life - and adult life has been worse than childhood. I started boarding school at six - and while I was homesick for some time, the camaraderie of other inmates, uh, students, was the only thing that kept me mildly sane…

Thanks for this, the first half of the comment perfectly sums up my last few years. I've moved out of London to try and live a more comfortable and less hectic life in a smaller city, now I find I'm so alone I want to move back to the city just to be with my friends. I'd love to be in the middle of nowhere, or anywhere else in the world, but the "friends" problem is always so understated. I _need_ friends(hip), or I…

I found that it's like a furnace that still burns hot from your momentum, but when you stop throwing in fuel (social interaction, feeling that you belong), the creative and productive juices do dry up and you end up, maybe literally, dehydrated; and I fondly remember getting my best ideas and impulses after good times spent with friends.

Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#83

Post by doug1001 »

madaxe_again wrote: post #35
grondilu wrote: post #4

Lately I've become more and more convinced that indeed, modern society sucks, or at the very least that I, and people like me, am not well equipped to flourish in it. I'm sure some people are though, but I suspect they are becoming the minority. Few days ago I also read Ted Kaczynski's essay[1], and it's hard for me not to acknowledge how right he is on many points. However, I do believe it is possible to survive all…

It’s also possible to live differently. I played the stoic for decades until the isolation of being a business owner living in a city pushed me over the brink. I’ve struggled with loneliness my entire life - and adult life has been worse than childhood. I started boarding school at six - and while I was homesick for some time, the camaraderie of other inmates, uh, students, was the only thing that kept me mildly sane…

thanks for sharing; i was a (catholic) boarding school lad from age 6 until university

deeply envious envious of the place you've chose to live

where i've had so many excellent days out (snowdonia mostly)--bunk at pen-y-pass YHA, snowdon horseshoe, glyders traverse, etc), then finish each day with a litre mug of tea at Pete's in Llanberis

Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#85

Post by voxl »

grondilu wrote: post #4

Lately I've become more and more convinced that indeed, modern society sucks, or at the very least that I, and people like me, am not well equipped to flourish in it. I'm sure some people are though, but I suspect they are becoming the minority. Few days ago I also read Ted Kaczynski's essay[1], and it's hard for me not to acknowledge how right he is on many points. However, I do believe it is possible to survive all…

I couldn't get past the first paragraph in Ted Kaczynski's essay.

He makes a lot of claims, with little to no evidence. You can cherry pick notions of stoicism from it (and incorrectly claim that it can be a universally applied philosophy), but what you've linked is essentially just propaganda.

Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#86

Post by dominotw »

grondilu wrote: post #4

Lately I've become more and more convinced that indeed, modern society sucks, or at the very least that I, and people like me, am not well equipped to flourish in it. I'm sure some people are though, but I suspect they are becoming the minority. Few days ago I also read Ted Kaczynski's essay[1], and it's hard for me not to acknowledge how right he is on many points. However, I do believe it is possible to survive all…

I would say fooling your mind is not easy. Definition of mind is "something that seeks" to want a "mind that doesn't seek" is meaningless and absurd. Its like wanting a nose that doesn't breathe.

Sure you can come up with various philosophies like stoicism, Buddhism ect but you are merely trading one loop of seeking for another. Now you are stuck in a 'non-seeking' loop and failure to achieve 'non-seeking'.

Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#87

Post by goldfeld »

bbctol wrote: post #78
unabst wrote: post #37

We're paying the price for the proliferation of existentialism, and it's flavor of capitalism and justice. "You're on your own" is good when reaping rewards and thriving in a meritocracy, but not when you need help, are losing, or just want warmth. But a healthy dose of loneliness is what has us reaching for each other. So we should all just give in, and reach for each other. Natural feeling tend to take care of them…

How are you defining "existentialism" here?

I'd think it's a variation of the "life is meaningless and we're all irrelevant specks of dust anyway" line of thinking.

Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#88

Post by darepublic »

solarkraft wrote: post #23
acorkery wrote: post #3

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they say "Yes, why?", they're your friend. If they say "Fine." then they don't trust you. If they tell you "No, ..." they think you're a close friend I'm guessing you're a programmer :) It's surely all about getting them to talk and open up, regardless of their answers?

I'm guessing close to everyone here has something to do with programming, no?

It's more a comment on the switch statement style approach to personal interaction :p

Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#89

Post by cousin_it »

I think individualistic cultures like the West can only work by teaching their members many subconscious habits for pushing away other people. That's great because it enables individual creativity (not to mention freedom from some ugly hierarchies we'd rather forget about), but the flip side is that people feel more distant from each other.

Thankfully, solving this problem doesn't require changing all of society. You can solve it for yourself: take a few years to notice and unlearn your habits for pushing away other people. I'm confident that you have many such habits right now, from the way you stare at your phone in public, to your posture and facial expressions every minute of the day.

To give you a picture of the end result, imagine a stereotypical immigrant from a more collectivist culture. Their reputation for openness isn't undeserved.

Re: Modern life is lonely – We all need someone to help

#90

Post by Jhsto »

mikeokner wrote: post #80

I think a large part of the problem is that the younger generations have grown up with pretty strong expectations placed upon them to do things like go to college (at whatever cost), land a white collar job, climb the ladder, etc. The obvious solution is to own your decisions and start doing what you think is right for you, but it's far easier said than done to step out from under the expectations you've been saddled…

I think you are right. Just the other day there was a posting in our anonymous university group chat and someone complained how she thinks she is unable to start and finish masters degree and its thesis work. The first suggestion which adviced taking time off to re-evaluate her choices of continuing with graduate studies were downvoted. Instead, replies supporting going through the masters with various lifehacks, even though the OP clearly states she doesn't want to do it, were upvoted.

I understand its natural for students to pep talk their peers to study more, but I don't understand why controversial suggestions are being dismissed. I almost feel like these calls for help are just seeking validation to continue hoop jumping instead of actually finding alternative ways to fix the root cause. It makes me sad to think that my peers don't think they are ready for working life until they graduate, whilst I would, as an employer, much rather hire someone capable of self-inspection and listening of people with differentiating viewpoints.

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