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The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

techcrunch.com

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Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#81

Post by ce4 »

smnscu wrote: post #76
nezza-_- wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe these watches used to be known under the Withings brand which got bought by Nokia. Very nice design (Max Bill inspired I guess).

Yes, I should've mentioned Withings. I think I've heard good things about them in the past as well, they used to do a scale that now, wow, looks even better [1]. 1: https://health.nokia.com/uk/en/body

The steel has no heart rate sensor. Nokias Steel HR has one, however after the aquisition the app quality tanked [1], and my SO had to return both Steel HR and scale for this reason. Connection issues, synch problems and the needed weekly factory reset for both were too much of a hassle.

[1]: https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.withings.w...

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#82

Post by tbassetto »

downandout wrote: post #34

I'm skeptical about the accuracy of applications like this running on Apple Watch. I bought the Apple Watch Series 3 precisely because of articles like this. I now routinely get messages about how I've achieved my standing goal - while lying in bed watching TV or working on my laptop. If it can't accurately tell whether you're lying down or standing, it is unimaginable to me that it could be remotely accurate in dete…

After 1 year with the Series 2, I never had an issue with he watch not understanding properly if I was active or not, standing or not. I did calibrate it on the first day though: https://support.apple.com/en-us/HT204516 and http://www.idownloadblog.com/2015/05/12/how-to-calibrate-app....

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#83

Post by demomode »

PierceJoy wrote: post #33
demomode wrote: post #27

As someone with diagnosed apnea I have so many doubts about this. Machines to diagnose apnea have lots of sensors including electrodes, "chest-band" pulsometers, and "saturationmeters". I have asked doctors about capabilities of smart devices for apnea control or detection, all I got was laughs. Sorry but I think this is not true. Go and see your doctor.

> Machines to diagnose apnea have lots of sensors including electrodes, "chest-band" pulsometers, and "saturationmeters". It seems like a fallacy to claim that since diagnosis required complicated equipment in the past, that it will be necessary going forward. Machine learning is going to make tons of current diagnostic equipment look archaic in comparison. > I have asked doctors about capabilities of smart devices f…

> It seems like a fallacy to claim that since diagnosis required complicated equipment in the past, that it will be necessary going forward. Machine learning is going to make tons of current diagnostic equipment look archaic in comparison.

As someone sais below "ML is not going to replace raw input from sensors."

> Medical doctors are rarely up to date on the latest technology. I wouldn't be surprised if my doctor has never heard the term machine learning before in his life.

Current dignose equipament is big, invasive and unconfortable; often they require you to stay one night at the hospital.

There are tests programs about using those devices to replace current tech (obvious reasons: less costs, less invasive tests, subject owns the hardware…)

This kind of procedures are not used because "doctors are old and non-tech people", it's because it's not working.

Sure, apps and smart devices could replace some day those devices but they need more and accurate sensors. Extrapolation of data from a good-enough pulse rate sensor it's not a replacement.

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#84

Post by bamboozled »

RBerenguel wrote: post #80
downandout wrote: post #72

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's certainly possible, though I have noticed more quirky behavior than just this - the stand goal was just the most amusing one to me and that is why I posted that particular one here. I sometimes meet the exercise goal on a very sedentary day, while I don't meet it when I vigorously exercise, etc. I have a two story house and I climb and descend the steps probably 15+ times per day, yet for the current week , it…

When I work from home I have a standing desk, and it looks like the watch does not pick me as standing, so I almost never reach the standing goal there

How would it actually know if you're standing, especially if you're hands are on a desk? Heart rate, blood pressure?

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#85

Post by more111 »

RBerenguel wrote: post #79
smnscu wrote: post #73

The only downside to the Apple Watch in my book is the short battery life which should theoretically make it impractical for sleep tracking. I was recently stupefied to discover Nokia Steel [1] and how virtually unknown it is to the general public, my former self included. It comes with great design, no bullshit digital screen, the usual tracking features, and most importantly seems like it's a return to form for Nok…

Maybe the app I'm using for sleep tracking does not track enough things (sound is tracked with the phone, for instance, but heartbeat is tracked with the watch), but it only seems to consume 3-5% of battery of my watch (Series 2, small). When I started tracking my sleep I changed my charging pattern from night to "while preparing breakfast" (after waking up) and "while at shower" (evening). Of course, 8 months is a d…

Which one are you using?

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#86

Post by bertil »

omginternets wrote: post #77
justinjlynn wrote: post #11

Danger, danger: heavily regulated waters ahead! Remember these words well: "This statement has not been evaluated by the Food and Drug Administration. This product is not intended to diagnose, treat, cure, or prevent any disease."

I came to say "danger, danger" but for another reason. I think a whole generation of fitbit users are going to be horrified when their insurance premiums go up based on data that was purchased by insurers. If Apple watch starts making a health play, I don't see why it would be any different.

Apple has been aggressively branding as the company that does not need to sell your data because their margins on hardware allow them to.

It might not always be the case but they can future-proof that claim by keeping that data on your device or protect it using differential privacy.

What might happen if health plans become habitually based on tracking (which I expect will be the case) is that having an Apple watch (or nothing) will be considered suspicious and charged a premium.

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#87

Post by bertil »

ISL wrote: post #4
brandonb wrote: post #3

I'm one of the co-founders of Cardiogram and involved in this study -- happy to answer questions if folks have them! (EDIT: heading to bed, but will answer questions in the morning!)

I didn't see a reference in the TechCrunch article -- is there a technical paper out? Edit: A presentation is linked, as "study": Link to presentation: http://www.abstractsonline.com/pp8/#!/4412/presentation/4522... A followup: Does the neural network provide some extra insight into what part of the waveform/time-series of pulses is able to provide predictive information?

Sorry for the habitual rant, but I feel the need to point out those are not open articles. Your case is typically something of interest to people who have no reason to have access to medical journal stores and… :(

This thread is not the right place to grab pitchforks, just a reminder open source science was still an on-going effort.

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#88

Post by bertil »

azernik wrote: post #29
demomode wrote: post #27

As someone with diagnosed apnea I have so many doubts about this. Machines to diagnose apnea have lots of sensors including electrodes, "chest-band" pulsometers, and "saturationmeters". I have asked doctors about capabilities of smart devices for apnea control or detection, all I got was laughs. Sorry but I think this is not true. Go and see your doctor.

They say "90% accuracy" for apnea - definitely not high enough for a diagnosis. The study's lead investigator is talking about this as a screening test, not as a firm diagnostic. And given the involvement of UCSF in the study, I'd take this pretty seriously - just make sure to pay attention to the claims the study is actually making, and not the science-journalism hype.

It’s good enough to raise awareness and I believe sleep apnea could use that.

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#89

Post by kobeya »

smnscu wrote: post #73

The only downside to the Apple Watch in my book is the short battery life which should theoretically make it impractical for sleep tracking. I was recently stupefied to discover Nokia Steel [1] and how virtually unknown it is to the general public, my former self included. It comes with great design, no bullshit digital screen, the usual tracking features, and most importantly seems like it's a return to form for Nok…

I only lose 10-15% of a charge at night.

Re: The Apple Watch can detect hypertension and sleep apnea, a new study suggests

#90

Post by toxik »

smnscu wrote: post #73

The only downside to the Apple Watch in my book is the short battery life which should theoretically make it impractical for sleep tracking. I was recently stupefied to discover Nokia Steel [1] and how virtually unknown it is to the general public, my former self included. It comes with great design, no bullshit digital screen, the usual tracking features, and most importantly seems like it's a return to form for Nok…

I feel like there is a huge difference in the capabilities of the Apple Watch and the Nokia Steel. The Steel has a motion sensor, accelerometer, bluetooth and maybe wifi? The Apple Watch, needless to say, has a lot more than that: GPS, GSM, wifi, bluetooth, heart rate sensor, accelerometer, light sensor, etc. I'm sure the Nokia Steel fills a niche but I feel like the Apple Watch is much more interesting from a capabilities standpoint.
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