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Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

washingtonpost.com

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Re: Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

#81

Post by ocdtrekkie »

DannyBee wrote: post #69
ocdtrekkie wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think there's a lot of benefit to this. People would still debate whether or not they needed to disclose. Some people believe that if their posts are their personal views, they don't need to disclose. People might be more likely to use throwaway accounts for personal opinions or posts on unrelated topics. Since HN doesn't mandate any of this be provided (or accurate), it becomes useless. I usually don't discl…

I dunno, either people are there companies or they aren't. I am not my company, and a lot of people elsewhere aren't either. I don't think who we work for is really relevant at all unless they are trying to make offical statements. Either engage on the merits or don't. "Ignore this guy, he works for X" is not a useful line of argumentation. The only thing putting company names next to things would create, IMHO, is an…

One highlight point to me, is that as an employee posting on an identifiable account, you have two options: Convey the same view as your employer, or remain silent lest you risk being fired. (No matter how much a company claims this isn't the case, it pretty much is, particularly revolving around talk about that employer specifically.) I doubt there exists a public post where a Googler says they think Google should be broken up Ma Bell style, or where they state that Google's attitude on privacy is broken and wrong; anyone who said such would no longer be a Googler. And of course, since you're surrounded 8+ hours a day by people who generally find your employer and it's practices agreeable, you've got a natural bias anyways.

Therefore, the participation of employees adds a lean in their favor, and disclosure, if it doesn't neutralize it, at least flags it so people are aware.

Mind you, knowing you're a Googler, I did upvote your original comment, because I thought it was accurate and had value. And I do see the concern about people being dismissive of others based on their employers, particularly in comments not directly related to the topic being discussed. (Imagine trying to comment here with "Uber, Inc." after your name.)

Re: Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

#82

Post by cromwellian »

ocdtrekkie wrote: post #40
belltaco wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be nice if commenters like you added a disclaimer that you work for Google in comments that hand wave away Google's privacy issues.

Eventually you just get the gist for who around here works at Google. ;) cromwellian, who responded to one of my comments here, is also a Googler. Arguably, DannyBee is correct that the real issue is that credit card companies are allowed to sell this data at all. But perhaps the danger of this practice is especially highlighted by the fact that Google is now one of the buyers.

I put my disclaimer in my profile and I usually make it obvious from my comment I work for Google, but I really tire of putting a disclaimer in each and every message, it gets tedious after a while.

Perhaps HN should implement some kind of badget/sigfile/etc extension for this purpose.

But I'll also note that in my response, I didn't comment on whether or not what Google was going is a good thing, or even going about it in the right way, I merely commented that the information being speculated on is inaccurate and that there was a crypto-conference presentation that gave some details of what Google is doing that contradict what some of the commenters imply.

I actually understand the skepticism and I think it is related to the secrecy of the mechanism and if a peer reviewed paper were published, it might do much more to alleviate fears.

Re: Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

#83

Post by Paul-ish »

DannyBee wrote: post #4

Unfortunately, credit card companies/banks/etc have been selling purchasing histories, to pretty much all comers, for years. It'd be really nice if we could stop that instead of caring about the particular people they sell it to. IE It's not "better" when they sell it to someone who isn't Google, and I honestly could't give a crap about the complaint, which mostly deals with antitrust.

> Unfortunately, credit card companies/banks/etc have been selling purchasing histories, to pretty much all comers, for years.

Do you have evidence of this?

Re: Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

#84

Post by lawnchair_larry »

DannyBee wrote: post #68
belltaco wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be nice if commenters like you added a disclaimer that you work for Google in comments that hand wave away Google's privacy issues.

I've made very clear when i speak for Google and when I don't, and i pretty much never do (except on some licensing issues). If you want official statements from me, go elsewhere. If you want HN to be a place of real discussion and debate, it's stupid to try to tie people to their companies. I think very different from my company on quite a lot of issues, and i happily point that at too. To your point, however, I did…

That's not the problem. The problem is that ones opinions regarding the entity responsible for issuing their paycheck are inherently less valuable, and this context is important for others reading.

You might think you are completely objective and unbiased, as do most others, and maybe you are. But, most people are fooling themselves a little. Nobody will admit to themselves, let alone others, that they work for someone evil.

So really, if you want a place of real discussion and debate, it's important to tie people to their companies in cases where they are participating in discussions about these companies.

Re: Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

#87

Post by thaumasiotes »

rhizome wrote: post #24
philipodonnell wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Kinda. Insurance is about a pooling of risks, that does not mean that every risk level must be in the same pool. Houses that are built in flood-prone areas are forced to be in different insurance pools with higher rates than other houses because the risk profiles are different.

You know what I meant. OP only mentioned undifferentiated "someones."

Undifferentiated? They are specifically labeled as "higher risk".

Re: Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

#88

Post by idlewords »

simlevesque wrote: post #85

WaPo has the same power: they know what customers buy. They're owned by Bezos which owns Amazon. How are they different ? Why would Google's data be more prone to hacking than Amazon's ? This article is pretty hypocritical.

Bezos owns the Washington Post, but as far as I know there's no connection to Amazon or integration with Amazon. He owns it as an individual.

Publishers in general have very little visibility into user behavior, since they rely on third-party tracking tools and third-party ad engines.

Re: Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

#89

Post by sounders »

Credit card companies and retailers have sold anonymized purchasing data for years to help companies analyze online ad clicks to offline spend.

Auto companies have used Polk vehicle registration data and data aggregators to match a vehicle purchase to the user's online ad clicks. They compare how showing ads for certain models influences your car purchase (ex. Honda CRV) from your initial search (best family sedan) and demographic info (FB data indicates you are an avid runner, 2 kids, 1 dog, etc..). Retailers employ a similar model for basket size.

There are partners like Oracle Data Cloud, Nielsen Catalina Solutions, Neustar and LiveRamp (ex. IdentityLink http://identity.liveramp.com) that provide similar data for O2O measurement.

Re: Google’s new program to track shoppers sparks a federal privacy complaint

#90

Post by nibstwo »

One philosophical question I have been wondering recently is whether this problem could not be addressed by removing "real life" identity from the equation.

I don't think personalized ads would be nearly as obnoxious if I knew that the ad matches my browsing history but has nothing to do what name shows up on my passport.

Most of what people seem to take issue with is their personal identity in addition to the tracking.

The tracking for the purposes of relevant ads would be identical from the perspective of the advertiser (efficient/profitable) but much more private for the user.

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