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Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

theguardian.com

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Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#81

Post by RobertoG »

_delirium wrote: post #63
captainmuon wrote: post #60

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He's a lot of things, but not an idiot. Varoufakis was one of the few finance ministers who is actually an economist (as opposed to e.g. a jurist), so he was very qualified. But he went into the negotiations thinking that everybody was trying to solve the problem amicably, that they were trying to find a compromize everybody could live with. But no, it was pure power play. Germany and co wanted to keep the status quo…

I think that's part of the problem, Varoufakis is intelligent and an economist, yes, but really not a diplomat, and his job here as Greece's main negotiator was more a diplomat's than an economist's job. He was very naive, as his book somewhat admits, about how EU politics work (and to some extent about Greek politics as well, where he assumed Tsipras was on the same page as he was). Stathis Kouvelakis, a member of S…

Yes, they were really naive thinking that the meetings of the ministers of economy were about economics and how to improve the lives of the citizens.

This is telling about what the Euroarea is about today.

I suppose, at least it's a good thing if those naive professors, now that they are not so naive, explain the rest of citizens how the system really works.

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#82

Post by btreesOfSpring »

syoc wrote: post #64

It is interesting to note that Varoufakis worked with Valve on the in-game economical systems for Team Fortress 2 and Counter-Strike: Global Offensive before he got pouched by Greece. His blog posts are really interesting. http://blogs.valvesoftware.com/author/yanis/ Those in the know about the economies in the mentioned games should agree that Valve probably got a good return on his paycheck.

Also of interest is Varoufakis on EconTalk[0] interview in 2013, almost two years before the Greek electoral victory of Syriza and Varoufakis taking the political position of finance minister. You might hear from this interview how Varoufakis looked at Greece's crisis negotiation-position with the EU: that for Greece, similar to the employee-management structure of Valve, there was a lack of hierarchy between peers and only a room full of equals. In that sense and through the Valve-hierarchy of equals lens, much of the tone-deaf rhetoric of Varoufakis towards his peers though the bailout talks can be interpreted with a wider spectrum of sound. Varoufakis, it seems, sincerely thought he would bring "enlightened" new ideas of successful software development management to a negotiation table of frustrated, advantaged, EU financial stalwarts.

[0] http://www.econtalk.org/archives/2013/02/varoufakis_on_v.htm...

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#83

Post by RobertoG »

drzaiusapelord wrote: post #30
Scea91 wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Didn't Greece falsify data for years? That would explain the AAA ratings.

Greece has been cooking the books for a long time, even their entrance into the EU was fradulant. Greece is the blame here via its decades of fraud that finally caught up with it. As a Greek-American with an interest in Greece being successful I think all the finger pointing at Wall Street or Germany is asinine. Greece is horribly corrupt and tax dodging is like its national sport. Its like someone turned Chicago int…

>>I suspect the larger economies always saw Greece as their >>'little brother' and countries like Germany had a sort of >>"Well, if we give them money, they'll build industry and >>catch up to us eventually,"

Do you really believe that? After all we have seen, do you think that Germany cares about the greeks? And they say Varoufakis is naive.

Greece has lost more GDP for more time that the states in the Great Depression, and you know what? there is not end in view to that. They can't do anything because they don't control their currency.

Everybody know that the debt never will be pay, but instead of facing that, they just "extend and pretend".

All the predictions of future growth from the Euro institutions and the IMF are wrong year after year, but they just keep doing the same. What was the definition of insanity again?

If you have an interest in Greece "being successful" you should check the facts again.

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#84

Post by RobertoG »

ricw wrote: post #46
sgift wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yesterday, there was a news that Greece has reached an agreement for a new round of money in exchange for further cuts to pensions and removal of some tax exemptions. So yeah, it is going to happen again. And again. And again. And all to save a few German and French banks, because politicians feared the results of telling them "you wanted to play in the casino and you lost, now the money is gone" after Lehmann.

Or rather it'll happen again and again until the casino is turned into a viable and competitive economy. I wouldn't blame the Germans and French for trying to contain a crisis at its origin..

I'm not sure that this approach to economics of 'beatings will continue until morale improves', it's a so good idea.

If fact, I think that, as the data show, it's in the same league of 'Trickle-down economics'.

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#85

Post by davrosthedalek »

atmosx wrote: post #67
davrosthedalek wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As does the EU.

> As does the EU. Are you trolling? What kind of mechanism does the EU have? How does Germany have such a high surplus if such a mechanism is in place?!

It has TRADE surplus. You were talking about funds. There is a substantial amount of money flowing from Germany, France and others into less fortunate countries via EU governed programs.

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#86

Post by sgift »

btreesOfSpring wrote: post #82
syoc wrote: post #64

It is interesting to note that Varoufakis worked with Valve on the in-game economical systems for Team Fortress 2 and Counter-Strike: Global Offensive before he got pouched by Greece. His blog posts are really interesting. http://blogs.valvesoftware.com/author/yanis/ Those in the know about the economies in the mentioned games should agree that Valve probably got a good return on his paycheck.

Also of interest is Varoufakis on EconTalk[0] interview in 2013, almost two years before the Greek electoral victory of Syriza and Varoufakis taking the political position of finance minister. You might hear from this interview how Varoufakis looked at Greece's crisis negotiation-position with the EU: that for Greece, similar to the employee-management structure of Valve, there was a lack of hierarchy between peers a…

> Varoufakis, it seems, sincerely thought he would bring "enlightened" new ideas of successful software development management to a negotiation table of frustrated, advantaged, EU financial stalwarts.

What he thought (and later stated) was that people would be interested in solutions instead of blaming, finger pointing and political games. He reminds me of a goal-oriented team member versus the team members who want so save their hides at all costs to the detriment of the company.

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#87

Post by RobertoG »

pvg wrote: post #40
andy_ppp wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And you are proved wrong by the fact Greece's government clearly was (still is?) "an unsophisticated or under-informed borrower". I mean the outcome of this borrowing speaks for itself. When I take out a loan a bank usually asks for collateral but these loans to Greece are unsecured and not worth paying back. The banking system should have been left to fail but instead we live in this world where governments bailed t…

No, the fact someone takes out loans they can't repay doesn't 'prove' they don't understand the terms of the loan. I don't think any of the major actors in this look particularly great but it's not like the Greek government found a giant bag of money on their doorstep one day and nobody told them it came with terms.

So, I can lend money without worry and it always will be repaid?

And not only that, I will be morally right. What amazing times we live.

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#88

Post by atmosx »

davrosthedalek wrote: post #85
atmosx wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> As does the EU. Are you trolling? What kind of mechanism does the EU have? How does Germany have such a high surplus if such a mechanism is in place?!

It has TRADE surplus. You were talking about funds. There is a substantial amount of money flowing from Germany, France and others into less fortunate countries via EU governed programs.

No I'm talking about TRADE surplus.

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#89

Post by davrosthedalek »

nickbauman wrote: post #70
davrosthedalek wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As does the EU.

It has some sharing, but it's not enough. For example, California sends 180 billion in tax revenues to the fed while accepting approximately 30 billion in federal spending. In the EU this kind of thing occurs only in the single digit billions.

Indeed. The problem is that populist politicians in "paying" countries can use this as an argument for an EU exit. See Brexit. It's hard to sell to pay billions, especially if stuff like hours/week, retirement age etc. are often nicer in those countries that need the money.

Re: Review of “Adults in the Room” by Yanis Varoufakis

#90

Post by elorant »

atmosx wrote: post #72
cinquemb wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Furthermore, you can't just default on the debt just by saying so. There's a naivety among mostly Greeks that just by going back to drachma and defaulting on our debt will magically solve all of our problems. In a country that imports pretty much everything that would be catastrophic. Well thinking from a trader perspective, by defaulting and going back to the drachma (and leaving the EU), Greece would have more fl…

The OPs perspective in the Greek's mainstream media and elite's perspective. You can't even discuss the eventually of switching currency in the TV. At the same time other countries which are not on the brink of collapse are prepared to face an eventual break up of the Euro (e.g. LePen winning the elections in France) and the only who doesn't have a plan, and God forbid it comes up with one, is Greece...

Please, give me a break. It was the Greek media, and particularly TV shows, that launched Varoufakis to stardom. Even liberal-conservative stations invited him to spread his bs.

Just because some of us don't agree with defaulting it doesn't mean we're in the elite or we're serving some agenda. Please, you can do better than that.

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