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Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

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Re: Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

#81

Post by gumby »

aphextron wrote: post #79
gumby wrote: post #78

One thing to consider is the very trade-focused nature of the degree. My son is a German citizen, educated until high school in the German language, but he enrolled in a US university. Why? The US system offers a broader education at the undergraduate level. In fact there aren't undergraduate medical or law degrees the way there are in Germany (where you graduate and start practicing / start residency). Honestly I th…

>Honestly I think this distinction is part of a cluster of characteristics that make the US more entrepreneurial than Germany(and why I'd rather drive a German car than an American). There's a bit of trade off involved with this though. Not everyone is suited for entrepreneurship, nor would a healthy economy encourage most people to become entrepreneurs. The stable middle class of highly trained, well paid technical…

But that's my point: people seem generally happy with the respective systems. Americans by and large seem to like their system, but while I love working in Silicon Valley it's pretty hard not to notice every day that it has a pretty low quality of life versus other OECD countries. If people like it who am I to complain?

Re: Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

#84

Post by ilamont »

For a point of comparison, the annual tuition prices for colleges in Massachusetts:

http://www.collegecalc.org/lists/massachusetts/most-affordab...

Tufts, BC, BU, Olin, MIT, Northeastern, Brandeis all between 45k and 50k. Harvard 41k. When room, board, and books are factored in it's a quarter million dollars over four years.

Public colleges (Umass) are a lot cheaper but I've heard "fees" can run up to 10K a semester.

Lucrative for U.S. schools, ludicrous for students and families.

Re: Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

#85

Post by subpixel »

aphextron wrote: post #23

Should I study engineering in Germany? I'm looking at undergrad programs in California right now and the numbers don't add up for me. Not just tuition, but cost of living as a full time student as well. I also feel like it would be much easier for me (a non-traditional student) to get into a better university over there, as they pretty much just look at your test scores. Not all this GPA/extra-curricular "well rounde…

Pro-tip: consider starting college in the US, taking two semesters of German, and then doing this after your freshman year: http://culturalvistas.org/programs/abroad/congress-bundestag...

CBYX is a full year of free study and free living (replete with an allowance, free public transport, general coddling) in Germany, with the added bonus of being official guests of the German parliament. The only requirement is that you have a high school diploma and be between 18 and 24.

The program has a 'professional' focus, but when I did it most of us were still in college and returned to finish our degrees in the US. Back then that seemed very important, but today much less so and there's absolutely no reason why you couldn't participate in this program and then opt to stay in the German university system. Again, for free.

Re: Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

#86

Post by ujal »

aphextron wrote: post #23

Should I study engineering in Germany? I'm looking at undergrad programs in California right now and the numbers don't add up for me. Not just tuition, but cost of living as a full time student as well. I also feel like it would be much easier for me (a non-traditional student) to get into a better university over there, as they pretty much just look at your test scores. Not all this GPA/extra-curricular "well rounde…

Consider studying in Netherlands if you look for programs in English.

Re: Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

#87

Post by nshelly »

paganel wrote: post #73
MarkMc wrote: post #71

If you are a young person living in a poor country, the two best investments you can make to improve your standard of living are (a) get a university education; and (b) immigrate to a rich country. Germany offers both: 1. A free undergraduate university degree 2. For every graduate: 18 month work visa after graduation 3. For every STEM graduate who earns more than EUR 40,000 per year: approval to work in Germany fore…

> Yes, you must first learn German, Maybe because of this? > be able to borrow EUR 9,000 to apply for the student visa Also, this. 9,000 euros does not seem like too much for people from first-world countries, but for people coming from relatively speaking much poorer countries that sum is quite high.

Yes, exactly. Learning a foreign language not widely spoken outside of Europe, while also taking college-level math and science courses is a high barrier to entry. This is the primary reason Germany is able to pull this off. If a high-quality college education were free in an English-speaking country, say Australia, there would be a lot more international students willing and able to enroll there. After graduating, you could take the degree and move anywhere in the English-speaking world (work visa permitting). In Germany at least, they assume because you achieved a high proficiency in German there's high likelihood you'll stay and work there for at least a few years after graduation. In a way, this is also true of the job market -- if you're able to get a job in Germany, or Italy, Sweden etc, anywhere where the language is not used widely outside of that country, then you have proved your qualifications and dedication to the country enough to warrant a work visa.

Also many Ivy Plus schools offer free tuition to international students who qualify for need-based aid. US taxpayers subsidize these schools indirectly through the tax-exempt endowments, corporate income and federal grant money.

Re: Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

#88

Post by zhte415 »

aphextron wrote: post #23

Should I study engineering in Germany? I'm looking at undergrad programs in California right now and the numbers don't add up for me. Not just tuition, but cost of living as a full time student as well. I also feel like it would be much easier for me (a non-traditional student) to get into a better university over there, as they pretty much just look at your test scores. Not all this GPA/extra-curricular "well rounde…

Take a look around all of Europe, especially Northern Europe. Denmark and Sweden used to have a wide range of undergraduate degrees 100% in English with minimal fees - this was a few years ago hence suggesting to look around; countries update their policies based on demographic need and political trend. Netherlands too. For international students language classes could be taken for credit or not for credit.

Re: Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

#89

Post by meric »

MarkMc wrote: post #71

If you are a young person living in a poor country, the two best investments you can make to improve your standard of living are (a) get a university education; and (b) immigrate to a rich country. Germany offers both: 1. A free undergraduate university degree 2. For every graduate: 18 month work visa after graduation 3. For every STEM graduate who earns more than EUR 40,000 per year: approval to work in Germany fore…

I think it's because for 9000 euros the students can study medicine in their home countries at a good university and not have to learn German, then move many places in the world with a skilled employment visa.

Re: Why Germany Educates International Students for Free

#90

Post by codedokode »

paganel wrote: post #73
MarkMc wrote: post #71

If you are a young person living in a poor country, the two best investments you can make to improve your standard of living are (a) get a university education; and (b) immigrate to a rich country. Germany offers both: 1. A free undergraduate university degree 2. For every graduate: 18 month work visa after graduation 3. For every STEM graduate who earns more than EUR 40,000 per year: approval to work in Germany fore…

> Yes, you must first learn German, Maybe because of this? > be able to borrow EUR 9,000 to apply for the student visa Also, this. 9,000 euros does not seem like too much for people from first-world countries, but for people coming from relatively speaking much poorer countries that sum is quite high.

9000 euros is a large sum for countries where an average monthly salary can be around 500 euro or less. Only wealthy families (whose kids don't really need German education) would afford that.
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