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London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

bbc.co.uk

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Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#81

Post by oskarth »

fridek wrote: post #72

Currently the shortest LGW-CDG flight is 1h. There is LCY-CDG lasting 1h 20m. For both cities it takes 30 - 60m to get to the airport from central location and you should be there at least 1h before the departure (for a total of 2-3h non-flight time). This makes total travel 3h - 4h30m. For comparison, the fastest train is 2h 25m. I guess you need to travel to and from the train station too, but it's definitely more…

Not to mention that taking the train between London and Paris is actually very pleasant, unlike taking a flight. When I worked in London I often used to go to Paris over the weekend, and it felt so luxurious to be able to wake up in Paris on Monday morning and be at my desk just after 9am in London (due to the time difference). The time on the train is all quality time that you can spend working, reading or eating a nice meal.

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#82

Post by pharrington »

ptaipale wrote: post #11

TL;DR: If I read things right, the BBC article is highly misleading and the plane still uses jet fuel. Longer version: The article mentions "removing the need for jet fuel" but does not explain how the engines of this "electric" plane work. Propellers run by electric motors, or what? No. Wright Electric's own site is scant on technical details and concentrates on praising the great team in its blog. From browsing oth…

From weflywright.com:

    As Bart wisely suggested, we’ve designed our battery strategy to be robust to different battery futures.

    If batteries don’t get dramatically better in the next decade, we design our plane as a hybrid with electric motors, like a Volt. It still has great cost savings as compared to today’s planes, and it doesn’t require massive battery advances.
    If batteries do get a lot better in the next decade, our plane is fully-electric and has fantastic cost savings. See chart #2 below; a near-future jump to a chemistry like Li-Metal doesn’t seem beyond the realm of possibility.
There is no plane. What they have at this point is a couple ideas for potential designs.

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#83

Post by lorenzhs »

mathw wrote: post #69
lorenzhs wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eurostar have around 80% market share on Paris–London for good reason. At 2hrs 15mins from city centre to city centre it's faster, less hassle, and more comfortable than flying. Security is less strict (you can take liquids) and you don't have to check your bags. Two large items of luggage are also included for every passenger. It's not even more expensive than flying if you book in advance if you include the price f…

Does depend where you are though. If you're in London or Paris or in easy reach of the Eurostar stations by train, then Eurostar is amazing. If you're in the north of England, it'll take you longer to get to London than it will to get from London to Paris afterwards. At that point flying starts to look a lot more attractive.

But then we're not comparing Paris–London travel times any more. You'd probably be faster off flying from Manchester.

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#84

Post by [deleted] »

aninhumer wrote: post #66
lorenzhs wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eurostar have around 80% market share on Paris–London for good reason. At 2hrs 15mins from city centre to city centre it's faster, less hassle, and more comfortable than flying. Security is less strict (you can take liquids) and you don't have to check your bags. Two large items of luggage are also included for every passenger. It's not even more expensive than flying if you book in advance if you include the price f…

I assume that's just market share of travel specifically between the two cities? There's also the market of connecting flights to consider.

[deleted]

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#85

Post by mcintyre1994 »

selectodude wrote: post #70
aninhumer wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I assume that's just market share of travel specifically between the two cities? There's also the market of connecting flights to consider.

There aren't any flights to anywhere in the world out of London that would connect through Paris unless you require a flight on Air France.

I think the parent might mean eg. travel from the UK outside of London to Paris, and France outside of Paris to London. In that case you'd probably spend longer traveling to the Eurostar in your own country than on the Eurostar. The same would be true if you traveled to an airport in London/Paris to fly, but there's the alternative of flying from a regional airport direct to London/Paris instead.

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#86

Post by brians »

wlll wrote: post #61
jakozaur wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe we should think outside of the box. What if, aircraft doesn't need to store all of the required energy on-board? E.g. transmit energy wirelessly through microwave and just have enough fuel for emergencies.

Planes I've been on regularly fly above the clouds, I wonder how much energy could be generated by covering the entire top of the aircraft with solar panels? I don't work in this field so as far as I know it could be a drop in the ocean. Clearly only possible during the day though.

Durability is a problem here too: these things fly through hailstorms and thunderstorms, and it'd be nice to have power coming out the other side.

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#87

Post by cgb223 »

oskarth wrote: post #81
fridek wrote: post #72

Currently the shortest LGW-CDG flight is 1h. There is LCY-CDG lasting 1h 20m. For both cities it takes 30 - 60m to get to the airport from central location and you should be there at least 1h before the departure (for a total of 2-3h non-flight time). This makes total travel 3h - 4h30m. For comparison, the fastest train is 2h 25m. I guess you need to travel to and from the train station too, but it's definitely more…

Not to mention that taking the train between London and Paris is actually very pleasant, unlike taking a flight. When I worked in London I often used to go to Paris over the weekend, and it felt so luxurious to be able to wake up in Paris on Monday morning and be at my desk just after 9am in London (due to the time difference). The time on the train is all quality time that you can spend working, reading or eating a…

That sounds incredibly nice. I'm envious

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#88

Post by baby »

fridek wrote: post #72

Currently the shortest LGW-CDG flight is 1h. There is LCY-CDG lasting 1h 20m. For both cities it takes 30 - 60m to get to the airport from central location and you should be there at least 1h before the departure (for a total of 2-3h non-flight time). This makes total travel 3h - 4h30m. For comparison, the fastest train is 2h 25m. I guess you need to travel to and from the train station too, but it's definitely more…

What you're saying. The only reason to take a plane vs taking a train for this distance is the price. Usually planes are way cheaper. But the hassle of taking a plane is really making it a tough sell as you say.

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#89

Post by gambiting »

D_Alex wrote: post #75

I am really quite confident that no serious development of electric passenger aircraft will take place during the coming decade. And it is not a question of feasibility, but rather of priorities. There is so much low hanging fruit to be collected! By the end of the decade, if all goes well, we will be in the middle of replacing petroleum fuelled cars and busses with electric ones, and maybe turning our attention to o…

On the other hand, the majority of the cost of almost any flight is the fuel. Electricity won't be free, but should be considerably less than tonnes of kerosene(I'd love to hear how much less exactly) - which means that obviously airlines can pocket the difference as profit, and they do love that. There's already loads of short connections in EU, so an aircraft like that should be hugely attractive.

Re: London-Paris electric flight 'in decade'

#90

Post by aninhumer »

mcintyre1994 wrote: post #85
selectodude wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There aren't any flights to anywhere in the world out of London that would connect through Paris unless you require a flight on Air France.

I think the parent might mean eg. travel from the UK outside of London to Paris, and France outside of Paris to London. In that case you'd probably spend longer traveling to the Eurostar in your own country than on the Eurostar. The same would be true if you traveled to an airport in London/Paris to fly, but there's the alternative of flying from a regional airport direct to London/Paris instead.

Nah, I was just overestimating Paris's status as a flight hub. Although I do wonder if connecting in Paris might make more sense from some of the smaller London airports.
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