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How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

haseebq.com

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Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#81

Post by aboonaboo »

_gjav wrote: post #17
Hydraulix989 wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, this is just sad. I know people personally that worked their asses off learning systems programming, algorithms, and advanced mathematics at top-tier four-year colleges with absolutely fantastic technical CVs that got offers that aren't even half of that. These are surely some of the smartest people in the world, too, but I suppose they don't play the "bluffing" game all too well (er, "negotation" -- call it wh…

He didn't get a 250k salary, that was total compensation, largely RSUs on a standard vesting schedule. He also donates 1/3rd of his pre-tax income to charity. He wasn't just a graduate of a hacker bootcamp, he was hired on by App Academy after he finished and was quickly promoted up to Director of Product. He spent a lot of time teaching people how to pass whiteboard interviews. He was probably better prepared for an…

Sounds like a lot of people here are jealous of his achievements

Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#82

Post by scarface74 »

My takeaways....

1. Communicate your BATNA but be subtle. When I was looking for a job two years ago and spoke with recruiters, I heard from a few that it would be "hard" to get $21K more than I was making at the time. I told them that I was happy with my current job at a major well known company (I wasn't) and that's what it would take to get me to leave.

2. Salary was the main reason I was leaving, but like he said, it's much easier to negotiate one time signing bonuses and things that don't cost the company money -- like more work from home days.

3. Know your worth - it's hard to negotiate more than your market value. When I was interviewing I had 10 prospects that were in various stages of the interview process. I was able to confidently cut the process short for some knowing I had others and I had outside recruiters negotiating on behalf so they could get their commissions.

Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#83

Post by jonatron »

mstade wrote: post #77
ThePawnBreak wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm sure you can negociate if you have offers from Google, Facebook and Palantir in London. Negociating only works in hot markets, and there are very few of them for tech in the EU.

Maybe, but the compensation range for developers in London is much narrower than you might think. From what I've seen, most startups offer in the range £30k-70k per year, probably with some mostly useless stock option deal. I've seen salaries out of Amazon and Facebook starting at £50k, and even at investment banks, for more junior positions. These are all basically suckers, given the cost of living in London, among…

I've only seen £70k+ for senior developers. Where my definition of senior here is >= 5 years professional experience.

Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#84

Post by sremani »

paulcole wrote: post #7
akhilcacharya wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He explains himself here: http://haseebq.com/about/ If you didn't see his previous posts he's clearly a pretty skilled self-teacher - negotiated up to 220K offers at Google and Airbnb despite going to a bootcamp.

>he's clearly a pretty skilled self-teacher I think it's pronounced "self-promoter."

So What? As long as his content is living up to the hype, I have no problem. I actually regret people who have so much to give and add value, do not promote themselves so much and morons and fillers take up the space.

At least for me, the dude is insightful and his long form articles about tactics are worth his "self-promotion".

Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#86

Post by mccolin »

Hydraulix989 wrote: post #11
paulcole wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>he's clearly a pretty skilled self-teacher I think it's pronounced "self-promoter."

Yeah, this is just sad. I know people personally that worked their asses off learning systems programming, algorithms, and advanced mathematics at top-tier four-year colleges with absolutely fantastic technical CVs that got offers that aren't even half of that. These are surely some of the smartest people in the world, too, but I suppose they don't play the "bluffing" game all too well (er, "negotation" -- call it wh…

The article contains excellent negotiation advice and its cornerstone element is honesty. Regardless of the author's history, this advice is solid.

Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#87

Post by bentlegen »

well_negotiator wrote: post #37
bentlegen wrote: post #25

Slightly-related: has anyone interviewing with Airbnb used the author's public starting offer of $220k total compensation to negotiate their own starting offer? Genuinely curious. http://haseebq.com/farewell-app-academy-hello-airbnb-part-ii...

Really sad to know he didn't get a good offer in Airbnb and you both think it's a good offer. But this looks totally like a new grad offer. I have my friends who just got offers in Airbnb who are getting paid 180k in salary and ~600K in stocks which is basically $330k/year. My other friend who is senior engineer with 5 year experience is compensated around 500k/year. I have similar experience and i recently did a job…

> you both think it's a good offer

That's not what I said, but thanks for your contribution all the same.

Airbnb offered him less to start. So I'm curious if someone in similar shoes (say, similar level of experience) used his expanded offer as a point of negotiation.

Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#88

Post by guitarbill »

rdtsc wrote: post #36

It might be important to keep in mind that there is a large difference between negotiating to buy a car and negotiating to work some place. A lot of the stuff you read seems to be geared toward "buying a car" -- used top 10 tricks, outsmart somehow the dealer, maybe act like an asshole a bit, and you're leaving and never seeing them again. I don't see it always working too well in job negotiations. Approaching it tha…

> So you "tricked" your future manager to give you a $50k more

In big companies, the managers don't have too much input, and no skin in the game. Plus, it isn't a "trick" and negotiating isn't unprofessional - it's just business.

Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#89

Post by guitarbill »

gbrindisi wrote: post #44

As a side note I've found that negotiation room in EU is so tiny if not negligible. Maybe it is just me but I suspect it's a mix between a different culture and a - generally - more unionized and segmented job market. Wondering if you guys have experienced the same.

I agree. Don't think it's because it's a "more unionized and segmented job market" though - no techie I know is in a union. I think it's a different attitude - most places don't want guys working 80 hours/week and burning out (actually illegal in some countries), just somebody who'll come in and deliver with a team. So a x10 dev, why would you pay for that? Hence, saner salaries (maybe, this is just a theory).

Coming back to negotiation room, often, basic benefits are already included (e.g. healthcare, although this seems to be true in the US, too). But 35 hour weeks, more holiday, longer lunch break to go to the gym, working from home twice a week, these are all things I've negotiated.

Re: How Not to Bomb Your Offer Negotiation

#90

Post by mstade »

jonatron wrote: post #83
mstade wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Maybe, but the compensation range for developers in London is much narrower than you might think. From what I've seen, most startups offer in the range £30k-70k per year, probably with some mostly useless stock option deal. I've seen salaries out of Amazon and Facebook starting at £50k, and even at investment banks, for more junior positions. These are all basically suckers, given the cost of living in London, among…

I've only seen £70k+ for senior developers. Where my definition of senior here is >= 5 years professional experience.

About £70k is what I see for senior devs (I'm fine with your definition) at well paying startups, but you can definitely get more in the city or the wharf at one of the financial institutions. For startups though, my experience says £70k is about what well paying startups are willing to dish out. There are outliers though, obviously. (Case in point: I know at least one startup that pay some of their engineers up and potentially even beyond the £100k mark.)

I don't know what Facebook, Amazon, Google etc. pay, but from what I've heard I'm guessing it's about in the same £70k-£100k bracket as the financial firms.

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