A federal carbon tax is imminent in the USA, and Exxon is pushing it • Hacker News Board

Re: A federal carbon tax is imminent in the USA, and Exxon is pushing it

#81

Post by WalterBright » Tue, Aug 30, 2016, 1:57 AM UTC

4ad wrote: post #73

mason240 wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In a capitalist society they are.

No, in a capitalist utopia they are. I don't know if you consider the existing society capitalist or not, but I can't give serious consideration to the idea that corporations even vaguely represent the aims of society. Yes, you can claim that people have aims, not societies, but people constitute societies, and the aims of 99.9% of people are not aligned with the aims of the corporations.

Having corporations in a capitalist society clearly correlates with things like reduced infant mortality, better health, etc. They do this by creating value that people want to buy and providing jobs that people want to have. Sounds representative of the aims of society to me.

Re: A federal carbon tax is imminent in the USA, and Exxon is pushing it

#82

Post by acusticthoughts » Tue, Aug 30, 2016, 10:48 AM UTC

RcouF1uZ4gsC wrote: post #11

DiabloD3 wrote: post #2

From what I can tell, this is a political maneuvering by the oil industry to not be nailed to the cross like the tobacco industry did: knowingly selling a highly toxic product that is conclusively linked to many disorders including cancer, and covering it up or minimizing it in the media for decades to continue profiting. Unfortunately, it's not going to work, and they will be ran out of business through the politica…

People who compare oil and tobacco ignore the benefits side. For tobacco, the positive benefits are very small. The oil industry on the other hand powers our entire modern way of life. * Ever fly in an airplane - thank oil * Ever ride in a car or bus - thank oil * Live in a cold climate and heat your home in winter - thank oil * Ever use plastics - thank oil * Ever buy something on Amazon and had it shipped to you -…

>People who compare oil and tobacco ignore the benefits

That's wrong. This article compares the two because it seems both groups committed fraud via funding misinformation campaigns that had a goal of affecting legislation on regulation.

Extremists are the ones who cannot deal with the obvious negatives of oil along with the benefits.

Re: A federal carbon tax is imminent in the USA, and Exxon is pushing it

#83

Post by just_a_guy_101 » Tue, Aug 30, 2016, 2:27 PM UTC

JamesBarney wrote: post #78

OrwellianChild wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you explain why you feel that way? How would a carbon tax impact rural communities specifically?

Rural communities spend more carbon than city communities. Basically they drive farther. Also less people live in apartment buildings which are more efficient to cool/heat because of shared walls.

Exactly James. I don't live in a rural area, but I did grow up in a small town. You have to drive everywhere. Most people live in houses. I have a problem in general with taxing for change. It always benefits the large corporations and crushes the small businesses. Besides that, the three letter agencies have a horrible track record of catering to corrupt companies.

Re: A federal carbon tax is imminent in the USA, and Exxon is pushing it

#84

Post by just_a_guy_101 » Tue, Aug 30, 2016, 2:29 PM UTC

sauwan wrote: post #71

just_a_guy_101 wrote: post #63

I feel like a lot of the people who push carbon taxes have little to no empathy for those who live in rural communities.

I feel like a lot of the people who are against carbon taxes have little to no empathy for those who live in areas of the globe most likely to become less hospitable to life in a few decades. And that's a lot more people who tend to be much poorer than even the poor rural Americans.

People in rural communities typically earn less and consume more petroleum based products. They don't have public transportation. A carbon tax will only further widen the gap between the rich and the poor.

Re: A federal carbon tax is imminent in the USA, and Exxon is pushing it

#85

Post by OrwellianChild » Tue, Aug 30, 2016, 6:42 PM UTC

just_a_guy_101 wrote: post #84

sauwan wrote: post #71

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I feel like a lot of the people who are against carbon taxes have little to no empathy for those who live in areas of the globe most likely to become less hospitable to life in a few decades. And that's a lot more people who tend to be much poorer than even the poor rural Americans.

People in rural communities typically earn less and consume more petroleum based products. They don't have public transportation. A carbon tax will only further widen the gap between the rich and the poor.

People in rural communities typically earn less and consume more petroleum based products.

The argument goes, this is exactly why a carbon tax is needed. The externalities of using fossil fuels aren't captured in the price, leading to overconsumption. There are plenty of ways to mitigate impact, either by applying a graduated subsidy to low-income populations, etc. Allowing folks to continue to live in a financially unsustainable way doesn't seem to be the answer...