July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa • Hacker News Board

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#81

Post by room271 » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:36 PM UTC

harryh wrote: post #44

Personally I think that the idea that these trends can ever be revered by some sort of world wide agreement to lower consumption is a pipe dream. People want to eat meat and drive cars and fly on airplanes. As long as they're rich enough to do so you'll never stop them. The only solution to this problem is technology. Some combination of green energy sources plus probably very large scale terraforming.

I agree that technology in terms of energy supply will be important, but is terraforming really a sensible option? Given how little we understand the climate, trying to manipulate it in this way feels like a very risky manoevre.

And there are big problems here in terms of externalities: my 'improved' climate might be disaster for you.

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#82

Post by davidy123 » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:38 PM UTC

goodcanadian wrote: post #54

sevenless wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> People who care about their childrens future should start planning now. If you believe this, wouldn't the ethical thing be to not have kids? Besides, global warming-derived refugee flows into Europe could well put it in a much worse position than the US.

If you believe this, wouldn't the ethical thing be to not have kids? I see this over and over . . . If you don't have kids, who exactly are you saving the world for?

> I see this over and over . . . If you don't have kids, who exactly are you saving the world for?

The billions of people (including kids) who already exist. Whether through adoption or supporting better general social programs. Clearly if that were the focus and the way humans thought the world would be a better place. But of course it's wishful thinking and people have every right to have and enjoy their own children.

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#83

Post by jmnicolas » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:38 PM UTC

staticelf wrote: post #37

I am lucky I live in the northen parts of Europe. I do not wish to live in America in ~50-100 years from now since there is so much guns and other weapons easily available. People who care about their childrens future should start planning now. I think when the shit hits the fan it will hit hard and fast.

Make no mistake there are a lot of guns in Europe : we had so many wars, WW1, WW2, Yugoslavia and now the Ukraine. Each time quantity of weapons "disappear" only to reappear later.

In France criminal and terrorists organizations are mainly using surplus from the Yugoslavian war but the Police still seize regularly WW2 guns which are still quite capable compared to more modern guns.

So if we didn't manage to clean the mess of WW2 70 years later, I see no reason why there won't be black market Ukrainian weapons at the end of the century.

I never understood people that think they are safe if only law abiding citizen don't have guns. The Police can't protect you from an immediate threat, they come to collect your body and find the killer.

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#84

Post by throwanem » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:38 PM UTC

oliv__ wrote: post #62

redwood wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I tend to agree: you can't go "back to nature" when you have 8 billion people running around, a larger and larger portion of which want to live like those of us in developing countries do (especially in the basic sense of having AC to escape this increasing heat). AC is a great little allegory for the whole thing... would you rather have AC and deal with hotter and hotter days, or forego AC and wait a century, have n…

Before AC, did people not live without it?

Before AC, people didn't know what they were missing. Good luck unringing that bell.

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#85

Post by pjmorris » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:39 PM UTC

harryh wrote: post #44

Personally I think that the idea that these trends can ever be revered by some sort of world wide agreement to lower consumption is a pipe dream. People want to eat meat and drive cars and fly on airplanes. As long as they're rich enough to do so you'll never stop them. The only solution to this problem is technology. Some combination of green energy sources plus probably very large scale terraforming.

How about Lunaforming? If there's enough water, there's certainly enough sunlight to split it for H and O, making habitation and manufacturing possible. Migrating heavy industry off-planet, the old L5 society [0] idea, might be an option.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L5_Society

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#86

Post by throwanem » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:39 PM UTC

snarfy wrote: post #78

harryh wrote: post #44

Personally I think that the idea that these trends can ever be revered by some sort of world wide agreement to lower consumption is a pipe dream. People want to eat meat and drive cars and fly on airplanes. As long as they're rich enough to do so you'll never stop them. The only solution to this problem is technology. Some combination of green energy sources plus probably very large scale terraforming.

There is another solution: less people.

Oh, by all means, don't stop there! Elucidate the enormities you're willing to encompass.

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#87

Post by ekianjo » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:39 PM UTC

pjmorris wrote: post #85

harryh wrote: post #44

Personally I think that the idea that these trends can ever be revered by some sort of world wide agreement to lower consumption is a pipe dream. People want to eat meat and drive cars and fly on airplanes. As long as they're rich enough to do so you'll never stop them. The only solution to this problem is technology. Some combination of green energy sources plus probably very large scale terraforming.

How about Lunaforming? If there's enough water, there's certainly enough sunlight to split it for H and O, making habitation and manufacturing possible. Migrating heavy industry off-planet, the old L5 society [0] idea, might be an option. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/L5_Society

How do you move stuff there though? See how hard it is just to have the ISS in orbit...

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#88

Post by tombert » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:40 PM UTC

harryh wrote: post #44

Personally I think that the idea that these trends can ever be revered by some sort of world wide agreement to lower consumption is a pipe dream. People want to eat meat and drive cars and fly on airplanes. As long as they're rich enough to do so you'll never stop them. The only solution to this problem is technology. Some combination of green energy sources plus probably very large scale terraforming.

Government intervention could conceivably work.

In the same way that we were able to get rid of the hole in the ozone layer by imposing restrictions on CFCs, couldn't governments give tax incentives and impose regulations that encourage a greener, more sustainable system?

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#89

Post by lallysingh » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:40 PM UTC

snarfy wrote: post #78

harryh wrote: post #44

Personally I think that the idea that these trends can ever be revered by some sort of world wide agreement to lower consumption is a pipe dream. People want to eat meat and drive cars and fly on airplanes. As long as they're rich enough to do so you'll never stop them. The only solution to this problem is technology. Some combination of green energy sources plus probably very large scale terraforming.

There is another solution: less people.

Populations past a certain level of prosperity for a generation or two do seem to drop reproductive rates. Perhaps the answer here is higher educational costs to discourage people from having many kids, and lots of alternative activities instead (Pokemon)?

Re: July was the hottest month ever recorded, according to Nasa

#90

Post by neuromancer2701 » Tue, Aug 23, 2016, 12:40 PM UTC

ZenoArrow wrote: post #55

semi-extrinsic wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure. Many of the countries with the largest emissions per capita are in regions where houses are heated in the winter and cooled in the summer. Given that indoor temperature is ~ 20C, the ∆T for heating can be much greater than for cooling, since cold outdoor temp can easily go as low as -20C, while really hot weather won't go much above 40C. Thus, in a warmer climate where you need less heating in winter an…

I'm not sure there's a 'need' for AC in homes, at least not for new builds. Would recommend taking a look at the work of the Passivhaus Institute: http://www.passivhaus.org.uk/ https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Passive_house

Compressed earth brick is pretty amazing. The whole house become a water vapor trap and the house cools itself as the heat of the day increases. Granted then you need to cool the house at night to refresh the thermal mass.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IuQB3x4ZNeA