Machine Learning and Ketosis • Hacker News Board

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#81

Post by jaggederest » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:01 AM UTC

rotomatt wrote: post #63

gtrubetskoy wrote: post #57

I don't have a weight problem, I learned about ketosis researching natural ways for improving focus and concentration, and somehow came across "bulletproof coffee". (I'm only using BP for lack of a better name and I don't endorse the stuff they sell online). To my utter surprise, something as stupidly simple as coffee blended with butter with coconut oil (or MCT) first thing in the morning did unbelievable things for…

Bulletproof coffee is really the strangest of any strange fad beverage/weight loss ritual I've ever encountered. But even weirder is that it really doesn't taste bad, and it did didn't do terrible things to my innards. The sound of it is really counter-intuitive: oily coffee, black. But then you realize that these flavors have been mixed together for years, whenever you have buttered toast and coffee. (now, minus the…

I mean, if you put cream in your coffee... that's basically liquid butter with some whey in it.

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#82

Post by Noseshine » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:02 AM UTC

hoodwink wrote: post #40

As a long-term ketogenic eater (10 years), here are my top simple tips. Unfortunately they were not gleaned using machine learning. 1. Watch your protein. Most people when first going keto will eat too much protein and not enough fat. Protein has an insulinogenic effect when eaten in quantity. Keep protein below 8 oz per meal. Don't be afraid to eat more fat. 2. Avoid cheese. Yes, it's technically low carb, but it re…

Have to disagree and vote for nuts and cheese.

I've never been really overweight, but still, even the slight problem I had is gone with the change of some eating habits. Mostly, a lot less carbs - I really don't need a bakery and I have to tell the Thai or Chinese waiter that I need only 10% of that huge load of rice (they always pack more rice than the rest - which already is a large amount).

Next to zero extra sugar (outside food items like fruit), no cake, no cookies. I don't need to, zero appetite for any of it. I don't even touch that honey jar in the corner any more. This is great for my teeth! (also according to the dentist, no sugar - no cavities, general rule). Always had trouble, now non, zero, with much less brushing.

I eat very high amounts of nut cream, which is just nuts but crushed to cream, expensive stuff but soooo tasty. A slice of toast, than add almost 1/3 jar of nut cream (mixed and/or cashew and/or almond white/brown and/or hazelnut) - so, really a lot - add quark (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quark_%28dairy_product%29) and some (not too much) fresh fruit and some non-crushed nuts from varieties that I don't have as cream, like walnuts.

No problem at all with my weight, unlike years ago when I really had to watch myself and did a lot of sports and running, so it's not like I can eat anything I want.

Same with cheese, but it's very little hard cheese, and all of it is high quality. A lot of my cheese is from sheep and goats.

Lots of veggies - but always with some meat. Can't eat as much as I used to any more though, my body has settled on wanting only a little bit of it.

Also, I found it important to NOT cut the (easy) carbs completely! Some white bread or rice etc. is absolutely necessary. It's just not very much, not even a full slice of white bread for the nut breakfast, for example. I think the diet that tries to brute force you into eating nothing at all of that kind of food is too extreme.

I can't eat a lot of whole nuts though, only the cream works. Which is just mechanically different, there are zero add-ons in my (organic) nut cream purchases.

Oh and I get plenty of sleep too, I don't use an alarm clock. Advantage of working from home.

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About the link, this is just statistics. These days "machine learning" has replaced the word "statistics", and now everything is called that, it seems.

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#83

Post by spearo77 » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:02 AM UTC

djsumdog wrote: post #35

escoz wrote: post #28

If anybody is reading this and curious about Ketosis, I'd recommend Taubes book ( https://www.amazon.com/Why-We-Get-Fat-About/dp/0307474259 ). It's a great review of scientific studies done over the years. I read that 4 years ago, spent another 4 months reading the listed studies, convinced myself it was a good plan, and lost 40 pounds with no exercises. I still do LCHF after all these years, and likely will never go…

I was told about Keto diets about three years back by a friend of mine. There's a lot of misinformation about food and health in the US and elsewhere, and for the longest time I thought low-carb diets were stupid. But after trying it and reading a lot of the research, I was pretty amazing. I went from close to 70kg down to 58kg over the course of the next year (although I've come up to around 62 ~ 63kg stable). I lik…

Whenever I relate my ketosis experience to people who ask, the biggest emphasis is on how "personal" diet is. You really can't just copy someone else's eating habits and expect the same result.

Listening to your body is very underrated skill. You can learn it (helps to have been an athlete at some point in your life) but you also have to do something about it :)

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#84

Post by jaggederest » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:05 AM UTC

bumbledraven wrote: post #46

frankus wrote: post #36

Totally anecdotal, but I want to second the recommendation of a longer fasting period. I switched to a strict-but-not-religious "no food between 7 pm and 11 am" system (with exceptions for weekends and social occasions). Within a few months I was down 15 pounds (~182 to around ~167) and had shed 4 inches off my waist (~34 to ~30). I'm about 5'10" and 41 years old. It's definitely helped with physical activity (mostly…

The only negative side effect (possibly unrelated) has been that I need a much cooler sleeping environment to be comfortable. Should that be warmer instead of cooler ? I find that my body temperature goes down when I'm fasting, so I need the room to be warmer to compensate.

I can confirm the anecdote, I run significantly warmer when I am losing weight and colder when I am gaining. It's a very strange state of affairs.

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#85

Post by spearo77 » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:05 AM UTC

samuelbrin wrote: post #72

I might have missed it, but doesn't look like ketone levels was one of the factors being measured. You can actually buy ketone pee strips at any drugstore for cheap. Would have been an interesting thing to track, since conventional wisdom says that ketosis is binary, you're in it or your not, and the actual ketone level doesn't affect the weight loss. I'm sure this has been put to the test in some experiments already…

An interesting thing to note about the pee strips, is that your urine only contains significant ketone bodies if your body is not using them all up.

I use a glucose monitor with beta-hydroxy-butyrate (ketone body) test strips for accurate measurement.

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#86

Post by jtmarmon » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:06 AM UTC

samuelbrin wrote: post #72

I might have missed it, but doesn't look like ketone levels was one of the factors being measured. You can actually buy ketone pee strips at any drugstore for cheap. Would have been an interesting thing to track, since conventional wisdom says that ketosis is binary, you're in it or your not, and the actual ketone level doesn't affect the weight loss. I'm sure this has been put to the test in some experiments already…

I don't contest that ketone level affects weightloss, but just to be clear, ketone pee strips don't tell you anything about your "ketone levels". They tell you the concentration of ketones expelled in your urine, which varies by a lot of things, like time of day and hydration levels.

Precision Xtra test strips will give you a far more precise and accurate measure of ketones in your blood and if you wanted to do anything quantitative like in this case study, you'd want to use those.

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#87

Post by mgraczyk » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:07 AM UTC

gtrubetskoy wrote: post #57

I don't have a weight problem, I learned about ketosis researching natural ways for improving focus and concentration, and somehow came across "bulletproof coffee". (I'm only using BP for lack of a better name and I don't endorse the stuff they sell online). To my utter surprise, something as stupidly simple as coffee blended with butter with coconut oil (or MCT) first thing in the morning did unbelievable things for…

As a counter point, I did keto for several months last year and found that my concentration and mental clarity were significantly worse while on the diet. My mind operated at about the capacity as it would have, had I slept only 5 hours the night before.

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#88

Post by jtmarmon » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:07 AM UTC

aantix wrote: post #80

samuelbrin wrote: post #72

I might have missed it, but doesn't look like ketone levels was one of the factors being measured. You can actually buy ketone pee strips at any drugstore for cheap. Would have been an interesting thing to track, since conventional wisdom says that ketosis is binary, you're in it or your not, and the actual ketone level doesn't affect the weight loss. I'm sure this has been put to the test in some experiments already…

On a related note; NuSI (Gary Taubes's Nutrition Science Initiative for better nutritional testing) has not published their first results for the carbohydrate/insulin link to obesity, but Dr. Kevin Hall discusses the upcoming results in this video and some people may be surprised (including Gary). _No Metabolic Advantage for Ketosis Found_ https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MiUyjMjuLl0

This situation has been highly debated among the keto science community. I call it a situation and not a study because they're publishing preliminary results for a pilot study. Hardly conclusive.

https://proteinpower.com/drmike/2016/05/06/contradictions-an...

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#89

Post by jtmarmon » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:10 AM UTC

mgraczyk wrote: post #87

gtrubetskoy wrote: post #57

I don't have a weight problem, I learned about ketosis researching natural ways for improving focus and concentration, and somehow came across "bulletproof coffee". (I'm only using BP for lack of a better name and I don't endorse the stuff they sell online). To my utter surprise, something as stupidly simple as coffee blended with butter with coconut oil (or MCT) first thing in the morning did unbelievable things for…

As a counter point, I did keto for several months last year and found that my concentration and mental clarity were significantly worse while on the diet. My mind operated at about the capacity as it would have, had I slept only 5 hours the night before.

Most people find that their alertness and focus improve significantly on keto.

The trick is that

a) it takes quite a while for your body to get adjusted to ketosis. 6 months to fully adjust, but the primary adjustment will take at 2-4 weeks for most people

b) during this adjustment period, you'll usually feel like shit. since you're running empty on the fuel your body is used to. but many people cheat, or accidentally ingest too many carbohydrates, persistently keeping their body out of ketosis and ensuring they feel terrible endlessly and blame keto for it.

Re: Machine Learning and Ketosis

#90

Post by spearo77 » Sat, Aug 13, 2016, 4:10 AM UTC

anamoulous wrote: post #60

stickydink wrote: post #58

Semi-related. For those who want to track their weight daily, efficiently, try Fitbit Aria (or one of the cheaper no-brand WiFi scales). Hook it up to Fitbit app, connect that to TrendWeight ( https://trendweight.com/ ), then throw away the Fitbit app. Whatever your goals are, however serious you are, I find it a great way to keep track. I just stand on this thing once a morning, and forget about it. And now I have a…

Cosign. I have one of the Withings scales and weigh in multiple times a day. I don't fret over fluctuations -- and I might fluctuate 5lbs in a day -- it's the long term trend line that matters and I can see it on the Withings site. Adding more data just helps.

Have you considered tracking skinfold measurements too? I know my weight can fluctuate a lot just from inflammation response after a hard training run. Weight seems to have too many factors that vary at different rates for different reasons.