81–90 of 112 posts
But I, too, dislike programming; languages are kludgey. (Ok, LISP and its derivatives aren't, but that's not solving the problem as much as reducing the problem set to one that can be solved.)
I like building things, and if to do that, I have to program, so be it. But I constantly feel like I'm building a house with Scotch tape.
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Are these two sites doing equivalent work? Without knowing what kind of work these sites are doing, this isn't really a useful comparison.
Yes, absolutely. Otherwise I wouldn't have used them as examples. They are basically implementations of the same kind of site but on different platforms, the one more successful than the other. In terms of raw performance I'd say the java environment is a little bit faster, but not by much. In terms of programmer performance I'd say the PHP environment is a lot faster than the java environment. The java I would quali…
I have come to the conclusion that the JVM combined with the vast number of libraries is great, but the Java ecosystem is not terribly optimal and over complicated.
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Yes, absolutely. Otherwise I wouldn't have used them as examples. They are basically implementations of the same kind of site but on different platforms, the one more successful than the other. In terms of raw performance I'd say the java environment is a little bit faster, but not by much. In terms of programmer performance I'd say the PHP environment is a lot faster than the java environment. The java I would quali…
I wonder whether it's not so much Java, but the excessive "architecture" around the language. My software uses the Jetty web server, a minimal framework, and JRuby for application code. It's very very fast, stable, not particular heavy on memory consumption, and I get good programmer productivity with the Ruby language. Importantly, I get to use all the shiny Java libraries instead of battling with Ruby gems. I have…
I don't think he's a happy person, either.
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It greatly depends on what you compare PHP to, but to highlight a handful of disadvantages, * PHP is considered extremely weak performance-wise * There is poor to no support of multithreading * There is no eventing system * As a web framework, it sins in mixing code & design (opposed to e.g. Django-Python or Ruby on Rails) (If the term "framework" seems unfit, think of "web-targeted toolkits")
PHP is not a framework.
In a way php is a framework.
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Read PHP's parser.
The parser in PHP 3 and up was written by Zeev Suraski and Andi Gutmans: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PHP
But I don't think any of them have anything to be proud of: http://www.steike.com/code/php-must-die/
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I wonder whether it's not so much Java, but the excessive "architecture" around the language. My software uses the Jetty web server, a minimal framework, and JRuby for application code. It's very very fast, stable, not particular heavy on memory consumption, and I get good programmer productivity with the Ruby language. Importantly, I get to use all the shiny Java libraries instead of battling with Ruby gems. I have…
One day someone will come up with a 'runnable war file' that contains the whole web application+container and does not require unpacking or other manipulation, entirely stand-alone.
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One day someone will come up with a 'runnable war file' that contains the whole web application+container and does not require unpacking or other manipulation, entirely stand-alone.
Would it actually be that hard to put everything in a single jar file and generate a class to boot it? Is it more than tracing dependencies and setting up the servlet configuration? Admittedly I have avoided the whole Java infrastructure, but using Jetty as an embedded web server has been painless.
Not unpacking a .war file would be a fairly major deal I think.
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Let's put the term "framework" aside. The Wikipedia article states it is "a basic conceptual structure used to solve or address complex issues, usually a set of tools, materials or components". I believe a scripting language that is pre-designed for website design could be considered a framework, but it's not that important whether there is a consensus. I'd like to see your source for the performance claim. To my own…
The benchmarks you're linking are pretty limited (especially the first one that tests just instantiation and method dispatch). Also synthetic but somewhat more comprehensive - http://shootout.alioth.debian.org/u32/benchmark.php?test=all... As I said, if threading is a problem in PHP, it's as much of a problem in Ruby and Python. Common workaround is async message queueing with a great number of solutions available fo…
Ruby is no gem either (I've always wanted to say that), with the one advantage of having dedicated high-level programmers as advocates within the community.
I haven't seen anything close to RoR or Django in PHP. Nor did I see a Twisted or node.js variant.
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But it's not intrinsically good; every one of PHP's advantages is offered by other languages, without all the downsides. PHP's poor design and implementation has probably cost the world millions of lost man-hours; loss that could have been avoided by choosing a better-designed solution. It's certainly an accomplishment to create popular software, but this popular software is not necessarily something that should be u…
>PHP's poor design and implementation has probably cost the world millions of lost man-hours; loss that could have been avoided by choosing a better-designed solution. Could you give some examples of this? I'm not a huge fan of PHP, but it generally works, as folks like FaceBook have proven.
The only thing that saves them is that most php users have no clue of what they are doing, have not training of any sorts, and no nothing but php and maybe perl, vb or whatever.
[1] Okay, I'm exaggerating and the latest iteration is no longer the menace it once used to be.