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Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

middleeasteye.net

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Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#791

Post by doom2 »

brainwad wrote: post #707
kharak wrote: post #697

Every time I've looked into the arguments for this being a genocide, I saw, at best, a description of urban warfare. Maybe I am wrong. If anyone is still reading this thread, could you write what you believe will happen after Israel won the war?

I more or less agree with you (if it were a _genocide_, you'd expect Israel to be equally targeting Palestinians in the West Bank and in Israel proper), but the report does have some specific examples of things that seem to go beyond "just" urban warfare. For example, Israel denied shipments of baby milk powder, which can serve no legitimate military purpose (except trying to prosecute the war via starvation of babie…

> you'd expect Israel to be equally targeting Palestinians in the West Bank

The Israeli government doesn't have to. They let settlers take care of that for them without any repercussions.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#792

Post by sschueller »

toomim wrote: post #579

[flagged]

This is literally like posting a rebuttal to the Holocaust and in a few years will be seen as that by everyone.

Second word is antisemitism, again conflating what the Israeli government is doing with all Jews. A deliberate conflation to justify the unjustifiable, absolutely abhorrent. This is what is making the world less safe for Jews and it's being done on purpose but Zionists.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#794

Post by mostertoaster »

nakamoto_damacy wrote: post #669
dluan wrote: post #525

Seeing PG slowly turn on this issue, from nothing into recognition and now into advocacy has been wild. Presumably because he has kids, and like many parents you understand with your eyes first, and then your heart. PG wields some amount of power in SV, but YC and others are still inextricably tied to what's happening. Thiel was just in Israel with elad gil, rabois, alex karp, joe lonsdale. It's just too much to list…

I used to shame PG for his elitist views. Now I celebrate his moral courage. One man cannot fix everything. Dear PG (I'm sure you don't read HN, but this is yet another echo), As I said on X, your own platform (YCombinator) is still full of hateful bigots who would censor/downvote even the mildest form of speaking against the genocide. Proof: this comment being downvoted. Downvoting as a mechanism is akin to censorsh…

I think what happens is things come from people with certain views, who seem to be part of some specific tribe, and so the presumption is they’re just spinning a thing for their own angle.

This happened all the time during COVID. Facts about its transmission and impact, would be immediately dismissed depending on if it went with the story we already accepted.

Everyone has already accepted a story of “Israel good”, or “Israel bad”, and online forums hardly change anyone’s mind.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#795

Post by ponector »

FridayoLeary wrote: post #759
ponector wrote: post #711

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is interesting, why videos from Gaza has strong effects while Oct 7 don't. Or videos from Ukraine don't. Israel bombing a hospital in Gaza is genocide while russians bombing child hospital in Kyiv is ok. Unfortunately not all nations are equal and many suffers because of that.

Lets address the elephant in the room. First of all, to be fair no one is ok with russia bombing hospitals. It's just that at this stage sanctions have been maxed out. Now from watching the coverage of this war you can't help but come to the conclusion that there's an organised but invisible movement opposing the war. The various humanitarian bodies and news outlets like al jazeera and bbc all quote each other in a s…

>> It's just that at this stage sanctions have been maxed out.

That is not true. Political will to introduce sanctions is maxed out. And current US administration has even less interest in doing so than previous.

>>But my point is what is the historic motivation for the anti israel movements? It's definitely not out of great sympathy for the palestinians although that's definitely why most Westerners are pro palestinian, but that's just marketing.I think i've established fairly well it all comes back to the Arabs.

Funny enough, no Arab country wants to really help Palestinians, to open borders for refugees. To host palestinians who lost wars with Israel.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#796

Post by velcrohn »

dluan wrote: post #525

Seeing PG slowly turn on this issue, from nothing into recognition and now into advocacy has been wild. Presumably because he has kids, and like many parents you understand with your eyes first, and then your heart. PG wields some amount of power in SV, but YC and others are still inextricably tied to what's happening. Thiel was just in Israel with elad gil, rabois, alex karp, joe lonsdale. It's just too much to list…

[flagged]

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#797

Post by throwaway3060 »

rf15 wrote: post #583
margalabargala wrote: post #563

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What about "there is war in the middle east, still/again" is remotely unique enough in the last century to be a defining moment of the half-century? If an event has the potential to be that, it's the near-peer land war in Europe. The current Israel/Gaza conflict is a blip that is mildly different in degree than the same thing that has happened every decade or so since Israel was created.

Not to this degree in the last few decades. But I feel you are overall correct, it's just that the Internet allows for much bigger coverage of the details of the horrors committed, and it's interesting how governments around the world now fail so completely to shape the narrative.

Governments are still shaping the narrative, it's just that the ones that are most skilled and successful in manipulating social media happen to be the non-Western ones (Think about China controlling Tiktok, or the various Russia election influence theories).

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#798

Post by sporkxrocket »

velcrohn wrote: post #796
dluan wrote: post #525

Seeing PG slowly turn on this issue, from nothing into recognition and now into advocacy has been wild. Presumably because he has kids, and like many parents you understand with your eyes first, and then your heart. PG wields some amount of power in SV, but YC and others are still inextricably tied to what's happening. Thiel was just in Israel with elad gil, rabois, alex karp, joe lonsdale. It's just too much to list…

[flagged]

Israel has been terrorizing and ethnically cleansing Palestinians since the inception of Zionism. Nakba was the original mass ethnic cleansing of Palestine.

October 7th was a valid reaction to people violently stealing your land and killing your families. The Palestinians had even tried a peaceful March of Return only to have the IDF snipe over a thousand people.

Israel is not a legitimate state, and never has been.

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#799

Post by vFunct »

velcrohn wrote: post #796
dluan wrote: post #525

Seeing PG slowly turn on this issue, from nothing into recognition and now into advocacy has been wild. Presumably because he has kids, and like many parents you understand with your eyes first, and then your heart. PG wields some amount of power in SV, but YC and others are still inextricably tied to what's happening. Thiel was just in Israel with elad gil, rabois, alex karp, joe lonsdale. It's just too much to list…

[flagged]

Why don't the hostages give back the land they stole from the Palestinians? Did they try doing that?

Re: Top UN legal investigators conclude Israel is guilty of genocide in Gaza

#800

Post by nakamoto_damacy »

mostertoaster wrote: post #794
nakamoto_damacy wrote: post #669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I used to shame PG for his elitist views. Now I celebrate his moral courage. One man cannot fix everything. Dear PG (I'm sure you don't read HN, but this is yet another echo), As I said on X, your own platform (YCombinator) is still full of hateful bigots who would censor/downvote even the mildest form of speaking against the genocide. Proof: this comment being downvoted. Downvoting as a mechanism is akin to censorsh…

I think what happens is things come from people with certain views, who seem to be part of some specific tribe, and so the presumption is they’re just spinning a thing for their own angle. This happened all the time during COVID. Facts about its transmission and impact, would be immediately dismissed depending on if it went with the story we already accepted. Everyone has already accepted a story of “Israel good”, or…

"genocide good" ? that can't be, but it seems to be the case for a vocal minority on HN (I got banned several times over the last two years for accusing Israel of genocide ad starting a shit storm of angry mob comments)
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