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Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

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Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#791

Post by foldr »

dang wrote: post #296
lupusreal wrote: post #60

This conversation is presently flagged. Why? When Ross was sentenced HN had a discussion about it with more than 600 comments. His conviction has been discussed numerous additional times in other threads throughout the years. His pardon is plainly on-topic for HN, and this discussion is a necessary followup to those previous discussions.

Of course it's on topic. Why did users flag it? Probably some combination of not liking the event itself and fatigue with political stories. But that's just a guess. In any case, we turned the flags off when we saw it.

Is it more on topic than the Musk Nazi salute thing, which you chose not to unflag? The comments are equally predictable in both cases.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#792

Post by meowface »

constantcrying wrote: post #722

Here is what the discussion looked like almost a decade ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9626985 Very striking to see how the sentiment has drastically shifted, while the facts of the case did not. There is a really cultural shift visible in how this issue is seen on here.

Both threads seem to share a similar sentiment: he should not serve much time for the drug marketplace but should for the murders-for-hire. There's just a difference in how many people believe those allegations and to what extent they should factor into the sentence given the charges were dropped despite the allegations almost certainly being true.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#794

Post by gspencley »

rescripting wrote: post #741
constantcrying wrote: post #722

Here is what the discussion looked like almost a decade ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9626985 Very striking to see how the sentiment has drastically shifted, while the facts of the case did not. There is a really cultural shift visible in how this issue is seen on here.

I'd be wary of drawing correlations like this. The people who commented on that thread are not going to be the same people commenting on this one. The topic isn't even the same; in the first thread the topic is his sentencing, and in this its his pardon. The attraction for people to post on Hacker News is mainly to complain, and so in the first you get complaints the sentencing is too harsh, and in this one you get c…

> and so in the first you get complaints the sentencing is too harsh, and in this one you get complaints that he shouldn't have been pardoned.

You can also hold both positions simultaneously without contradiction. That is to say that you can think that his sentence was too harsh while at the same time being of the opinion that what he did was a crime (and should be a crime) and that he should remain convicted and un-pardoned, just with a different sentence than the one he was given.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#795

Post by efficax »

constantcrying wrote: post #722

Here is what the discussion looked like almost a decade ago: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=9626985 Very striking to see how the sentiment has drastically shifted, while the facts of the case did not. There is a really cultural shift visible in how this issue is seen on here.

life in prison was too harsh, but a full pardon is too lenient.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#796

Post by haswell »

scotty79 wrote: post #710
rnernento wrote: post #660

In 2021, Ulbricht's prosecutors and defense agreed that Ulbricht would relinquish any ownership of a newly discovered fund of 50,676 Bitcoin (worth nearly $5.35 billion in 2025) seized from a hacker in November 2021.[78] The Bitcoin had been stolen from Silk Road in 2013 and Ulbricht had been unsuccessful in getting them back. The U.S. government traced and seized the stolen Bitcoin. Ulbricht and the government agree…

Wow. Suddenly the pardon makes perfect sense.

Why does this make the pardon make sense?

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#797

Post by haswell »

dbspin wrote: post #678
rnernento wrote: post #660

In 2021, Ulbricht's prosecutors and defense agreed that Ulbricht would relinquish any ownership of a newly discovered fund of 50,676 Bitcoin (worth nearly $5.35 billion in 2025) seized from a hacker in November 2021.[78] The Bitcoin had been stolen from Silk Road in 2013 and Ulbricht had been unsuccessful in getting them back. The U.S. government traced and seized the stolen Bitcoin. Ulbricht and the government agree…

[flagged]

What are you suggesting here? That the earlier bitcoin seizure somehow led to this pardon? I’m not following.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#798

Post by _yb2s »

I feel torn about this because it seems there was good evidence for attempted murder- and I cannot understand why they never tried him for that (seemingly larger) crime. However, for the crime he was actually found guilty of, the sentence was unfair and unreasonable. It seems they unethically sentenced him for crimes he was not even ever charged with.

I'd also argue he almost certainly saved a huge number of lives with Silk Road: the ability to view eBay style feedback and chemical test results makes buying illegal drugs far safer than buying them on the street. On Silk Road people could buy from a reputable seller with a long history of providing unadulterated products, and could view testimonials from other buyers who had sent the products for chemical analysis.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#799

Post by psychlops »

jjallen wrote: post #655
mrandish wrote: post #181

This is wonderful. I've never argued that Ross shouldn't have served time but it's always been clear his prosecution and sentencing were excessive and unjust. The prosecutors asked for a 20 year sentence, which seemed disproportionate given the sentencing guidelines for a first-time offender and the non-violent charges he was convicted of. But the judge sentenced Ross to TWO life sentences plus 40 years - without the…

But he’s only served a tiny fraction of what you say was an unjust sentence. So the jury’s still out as to whether he’s served enough time. Other hard drug dealers get way more time than Ross has served. Its astonishing that granting pardons to drug dealers and attempted murderers is something Trump sees as one of the more urgent matters affecting the most powerful nation on Earth. I wish this weren’t true.

Highlighting the polarization and weaponization of the justice system is worthy subject matter for the most powerful nation on Earth. It needs to be set onto a new path that is fair to all involved.

Re: Ross Ulbricht granted a full pardon

#800

Post by azinman2 »

_yb2s wrote: post #798

I feel torn about this because it seems there was good evidence for attempted murder- and I cannot understand why they never tried him for that (seemingly larger) crime. However, for the crime he was actually found guilty of, the sentence was unfair and unreasonable. It seems they unethically sentenced him for crimes he was not even ever charged with. I'd also argue he almost certainly saved a huge number of lives wi…

Not going to comment on the murder part as that’s well discussed here.

I would take issue with assuming that it was net positive with ratings. Given the anonymous nature handling bots spamming fake reviews would be even harder to catch here, and you ultimately don’t know who ended up addicted/hooked/DUI’s etc from the easy availability this provided. I’m not sure the total effects could ever be qualified, but it’s not like unadulterated drugs are automatically safe. Just look at how many lives pharma-grade opioids ruined, even though they were “safe”.

That’s also not to mention guns and all kinds of other dangerous & illegal parts of it.

I do not understand why he pardoned this guy when he’s supposedly anti-drug and anti-cartel.

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