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California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

reuters.com

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Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#781
post #569

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The current ride pricing feels about 10-20% less than an Uber in SF - but I haven't really checked properly. So don't expect the rideshare product (Waymo One) to be a super cheap option.

This morning my coworkers rode in together in a Waymo. One told me it was $16 while an Uber would have been $35.

I read that Waymo is losing 2 to 3 billion dollars a year.

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#782

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's illegal and we send people to jail for it. What is this.

Making something illegal doesn't stop some people from doing it, so it's something that should be considered when looking at the overall safety of human drivers. One benefit of robots driving is that they won't get drunk, get distracted because they had a stressful day, get drowsy but still try to make it home, speed because they're late for an appointment, etc...

I don't get it, someone's clearly willing to break the law if they are drunk driving, unless you're banning steering wheels I'm not sure how that's going to help.

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#783
post #401

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since it seems people are interested. I had one situation which this sort of thing made me a bit uneasy (So one gripe actually). I was sitting back right seat. Waymo was waiting to make an unprotected left turn over two lanes. There was a vehicle waiting to also make an unprotected left in the other direction. Behind it was a truck. Waymo made that turn where I wouldn't have. I thought it through after and it had at…

I'm laughing because I know that intersection well from taking my kids to basketball practice. I might have had the opposite reaction to you had my car not gone when it could. Also, you have greater visibility as a driver in the front than a passenger in the back, so it's likely that an experienced SF driver might have also done the same thing (speaking as someone who's driven in the city for over 20 years)

I get your point. But the approach to the situation differs I think. A human driver would creep into the intersection to get a better view and then go if clear. The Waymo proceeded with far more confidence. Just better vision. It starting tracking vehicles earlier than a human would (this is shown in a simplified way on the display inside - but I wasn't watching in this case). As it pulled into the intersection, it's front camera and/or lidar has a much better angle than a human driver so can make a go/no-go assessment earlier and without hesitation.

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#784

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a lose lose situation. I've been reading conversation about self driving cars for years and what you always heard back in the days is that they were way too conservative on these kinds of turns and blocked traffic. Hell even in this very thread people are saying that about Cruise. Yet when they make it more aggressive, people feel unsafe. As you say, this is something they are constantly tweaking to find the per…

You should be able to set the "aggressive" level. I believe Tesla has this option internally on their FSD Beta. Hopefully you will be able to set this level for robot taxis and personal vehicles like you can with (some) human drivers.

Call me cynical, but this feels like a way for tech companies to absolve themselves of responsibility.

“Your Honor, the pedestrian would have never been struck if the driver had set the system in its most conservative mode as we suggest on page 1,047 of Terms and Conditions.” /s

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#785
post #122

if people weren't VC brained they would realize that the way to prevent traffic deaths isn't to build fancy self driving cars, it's to invest in safer, more pedestrian friendly infrastructure and use the boring technology that already exists to get people where they want to go. the future is on buses and trains and bikes and pedestrian friendly 15 minute communities

But how would they make money off pedestrian infrastructure or old boring technology? If there's not an app for it, then no one's interested.

A lot of companies are getting very rich building boring technology (e.g. $2.6 billion per subway mile).

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#786

From my perspective as a person who lives in San Francisco and also drives a LOT (10-20k miles per year, and many small drives within the city): Cruise cars do not perform acceptably. They manage to avoid collisions by driving extremely conservatively, but the way they traverse, say, a left turn against traffic is absurd. They slow everyone down, including emergency vehicles and public transit, by performing far belo…

I love that we're at a point in time where we can compare and contrast two different self driving systems.

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#787

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It’s not that it currently sucks. Even if it was the cleanest, safest, most connected system it still sucks compared to a personal vehicle (ideally electric and fully powered by renewable energy). It also means people have to live in dense apartments instead of spread out suburbs and semi rural living. I don’t mean privacy as in personal data, I mean not having to be in close quarters with other humans.

Even if we accept that the personal vehicle provides a better experience for an individual in a vacuum compared to ideal public transit, we're left with the critical problem that if a significant number of people choose to use personal vehicles instead of public transit, then there will be so much traffic that the experience will be awful for everyone. This traffic will cause travel delays, noise, pollution (from exh…

> then there will be so much traffic that the experience will be awful for everyone.

Perhaps. It's also possible that current roads could carry vastly more traffic driven by autonomous drivers instead of people. As a regular cyclist, I would be ecstatic if even if every human driven car on the road were replaced by 2 autonomous ones. Buses are some of the worst vehicles to be around on city streets (huge, poor visibility, frequent stops, filthy diesel emissions).

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#788

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If feel like Seattle needs an all day and weekend Sounder service, more than it needs self driving robo-taxis. 1.5 hours away you might be at the edge or beyond Sounder reach so this may not help you much unless you get a local bus to your closest station, but you can probably still just drive to your closest station and not having to have to deal with driving in the city. If the Sounder would run like the ferries do…

I am staring aghast with European eyes at a city of 4 million people where the commuter rail doesn't run outside peak hours. How do you get home if you go out for a couple of drinks with colleagues, or stay late for a call? You shouldn't be asking for a couple of trains between 8pm and midnight. They should be every half hour, or more! Midnight until 6am on Saturday and Sunday could be every hour or two. (I live in C…

I feel this way too, having gone down the online rabbit hole of urbanist content. We don’t need cheaper Ubers, we need trains!

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#789

From my perspective as a person who lives in San Francisco and also drives a LOT (10-20k miles per year, and many small drives within the city): Cruise cars do not perform acceptably. They manage to avoid collisions by driving extremely conservatively, but the way they traverse, say, a left turn against traffic is absurd. They slow everyone down, including emergency vehicles and public transit, by performing far belo…

average miles per year for male drivers in the US is 16,550. So 10-20k is smack in the middle average. not a LOT. ok, maybe it's objectively "a lot", but you are no more qualified than the average driver to assess.

maybe it's more compelling to say: as an average driver, EVEN I can see that Cruise is far less competent than Waymo.

Re: California suspends Cruise's autonomous vehicle deployment

#790
post #81

TxDMV needs to follow this. Fuck these companies. They are testing their garbage in dense urban areas. Too many times their vehicles just stop in the middle of the road. If it rains, vehicle stops. If the light is out, vehicle panics and stops. Somebody puts a cone on the hood, vehicle panics. If a single variable not accounted for in their algorithms shifts beyond expected range, it fucking panics. So much money dum…

This! A developed country is not a place where the poor have cars. It's where the rich use public transportation.

An advanced country is one where as many people as possible can go where they want, when they want, as cheaply as feasible. In the US, autonomous vehicles are the best bet for facilitating this in urban areas.
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