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Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

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Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#781

Post by kalleboo »

inkyoto wrote: post #528
jermaustin1 wrote: post #128

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think a lot of the perceivable speedup in M1 Macs is less to do with these benchmarks and more to do with optimizing the OS and Apple software for the M1 and the various accelerators on the SoC (video encoding and ML).

> perceivable speedup in M1 Macs Perception is key here. Of course M1's are perceived as being faster because: - video camera encoding/decoding is offloaded to a dedicated processor; - disk encryption is offloaded to a dedicated processor; - rendering is offloaded to dedicated GPU's; - matrix multiplication is offloaded to dedicated matrix multiplication processors (neural engines); - no wasteful memory transfers (ev…

We already had dedicated GPUs for all the graphics/video stuff and the T2 chip for the disk encryption in the Intel Macs. That leaves the unified memory architecture as the only innovation.

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#782

Post by numpad0 »

fnord77 wrote: post #427
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #245

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I just can't figure out what I'm missing on the "M1 is so fast" side of things. Two reasons: 1. M1 is a super fast laptop chip. It provides mid-range desktop performance in a laptop form factor with mostly fanless operation. No matter how you look at it, that's impressive. 2. Apple really dragged their feet on updating the old Intel Macs before the transition. People in the Mac world (excluding hackintosh) were stu…

> Compared to those older CPUs, the M1 Max is a huge leap forward. Is it, though? Its single-core score is roughly 2x that of the top CPU Apple put in the mid-2012 macbook pro. 2x after 10 years doesn't seem that great to me. Maybe that's more of an indictment against intel

Kids these days don't know the days when 2x was within realms of intentional product segmentation and at most 18 months worth of progress.

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#783

Post by out_of_protocol »

58028641 wrote: post #366
klelatti wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Thanks - interesting on OpenCL - presumably running on GPU? All that memory opens up some interesting possibilities. Also I thought Apple was deprecating OpenCL in favour of Metal?

OpenCL and OpenGL have been deprecated in favor of Metal. Geekbench also has a Metal compute benchmark.

How to compare Metal vs non-mac hardware then?

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#784

Post by vijucat »

konart wrote: post #608
shaklee3 wrote: post #579

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are vastly, vastly overestimating how many people like apple laptops. They're expensive, the OS is worse, and there's no speed difference outside of benchmarks. That combined with the fact that most apps are windows-based, and the games are poorly emulated or nonexistent, there's really no reason to buy an apple laptop short of bragging.

>the OS is worse Worse than what? Windows, that is even in 2021 is still a clanky garbage. Or Linux (any distro) that can't be installed on a newest hardware without any trouble at all (my relatively recent experience). An even then you get an OS that you have to fix yourself for it to work and feel remotely nice. Yet without decent software in most cases outside of software development.

> Windows, that is even in 2021 is still a clanky garbage.

That's how I feel about macOS. It's for people who prioritize maximum animations over speed. For example, Finder is so slow compared to Windows Explorer. I love Windows. I love the customizability I love the speed, and even 15 years ago, there were 10X more software package for Windows than Mac.

I hear that macOS in recent years (after 2019?) even allows you to change the drab grey color of the menu bar? That's progress! Maybe by 2030, they will allow you to move the menu bar to a vertical orientation because that's how a lot of people prefer it; there's less vertical space than horizontal on most monitors. I honestly cannot understand how one can stand this stifling arrangement where you are told, "This is how it is, we know better".

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#785

Post by pja »

hajile wrote: post #773
pja wrote: post #714

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Anandtech measured the max TDP of the CPUs in the M1 as being around 28W, with the GPU adding ~17W to that figure. https://www.anandtech.com/show/16252/mac-mini-apple-m1-teste...

That figure is compute workloads. Also, those measurements are “at the wall” and include RAM, SSD, and everything else. At the very least, you must subtract most idle power, but you also need to subtract more when DRAM/SSD kicks up from low power state.

That figure is after subtracting idle power. It’s right there on the chart.

The workload is described as "Compute MT" (i.e. multithreaded), compared with "Memory MT (i.e., memory intensive Multi-threaded workload), with a third bar on the chart being the average of the two.

It seems to me that the "Compute MT" is the closest to the measurement that Intel or AMD would describe as TDP. The M1 is a ~25+W chip, not a 10W chip, if we’re going to make a fair comparison with Intel or AMD equivalents. It’s still a great CPU of course, but it’s not magic pixie dust.

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#786

Post by kergonath »

f6v wrote: post #708
adrianN wrote: post #576

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It might be a long time before it makes sense to buy a non-Apple laptop. ...if you only care about the things that Apple laptops are good at. Almost nobody needs a top-of-the-line laptop to do their tasks. Most things that people want to do with computers can be done on a machine that is five to ten years old without any trouble at all. For example I use a ThinkPad T460p, and while the geekbench scores for its proc…

> Most things that people want to do with computers can be done on a machine that is five to ten years old without any trouble at all. Please, browsing web has always been pain on old hardware.

You cannot win this argument because for some people Lynx in a terminal is an acceptable way of browsing the web.

Also, people argue in bad faith all the time and a lot of people for whom it isn’t an acceptable way of browsing the web would pretend it is anyway to win an argument.

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#787

Post by ubermonkey »

vijucat wrote: post #784
konart wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>the OS is worse Worse than what? Windows, that is even in 2021 is still a clanky garbage. Or Linux (any distro) that can't be installed on a newest hardware without any trouble at all (my relatively recent experience). An even then you get an OS that you have to fix yourself for it to work and feel remotely nice. Yet without decent software in most cases outside of software development.

> Windows, that is even in 2021 is still a clanky garbage. That's how I feel about macOS. It's for people who prioritize maximum animations over speed. For example, Finder is so slow compared to Windows Explorer. I love Windows. I love the customizability I love the speed, and even 15 years ago, there were 10X more software package for Windows than Mac. I hear that macOS in recent years (after 2019?) even allows you…

Do you mean the File/Edit/View menu bar, or the Dock?

The Dock has been configurable forEVER. I ran it on the side for many years before switching back to the bottom.

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#788

Post by jimsmart »

zimpenfish wrote: post #678
soylentnewsorg wrote: post #615

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I do get it - you define pro as a guy at work running his backup application in a web browser, and the hipster at starbucks doing "graphic design." I define pro as "a workstation." The m1 does not emulate x86. You literally don't know what you're talking about. Which explains why you define a kid's toy as "pro." I get it - you're getting paid. So is the barista at the starbucks you work from. Kia might define their k…

> The m1 does not emulate x86. You literally don't know what you're talking about. What is it doing when it runs x86_64 binaries then?

Rosetta 2 kicks in, performs a JIT/AOT translation of the x86 instructions to ARM instructions, executes those, and caches the resulting ARM binary for later use.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rosetta_(software)

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#789

Post by zerkten »

adrianN wrote: post #605
dijit wrote: post #599

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So what is the trade off you think you’re making? This is weird. I feel like I’m talking to someone who has a fixed opinion against something. It’s good for _everyone_ that these chips are as fast as the best chips on the market, have crazy low power consumption and the cost for new is comparable. Intel have been overcharging for more than a decade when innovation stagnated. Honestly, I’m not so hot on Apple (FD I am…

The tradeoff I'm making is money vs capability. My argument is that most people don't need the capabilities offered by brand new, top of the line models. A used laptop that is a couple of years old is, I think, the best choice for most people.

This is fine and people who have budget limits have options both new and used. It seems like this has been the case for quite a while although things like the pandemic probably impacted the used market (I haven't researched that.)

The thing you are denying is that people have both needs and wants. Wants are not objective, no matter how much you try to protest their existence. There is no rational consumer here.

There are inputs beyond budget which sometimes even override budget (and specific needs!) Apple has created desirable products that even include some slightly cheaper options. The result is that people will keep buying things that they don't really need, but they'll likely still get some satisfaction. I don't suggest that this is great for society, the environment, or many other factors - but, it's the reality we live in.

Re: Apple M1 Max Geekbench Score

#790

Post by throwaway894345 »

mvanbaak wrote: post #372
throwaway894345 wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's Docker for Mac versus native Docker. Docker only runs on Linux, so Docker for Mac spins up a linux VM to run your containers. When you mount your Ruby or Python projects into your containers, Docker for Mac marshals tons of filesystem events over the host/guest boundary which absolutely devastates your CPU. Docker for Mac is really just bad for your use case. No idea what's going on with the thumb drive, bluet…

> Docker for Mac is really just bad for your use case. Nah, not just for mac, docker is really just bad. period ;P

What’s wrong with Docker? Are you opposed to Docker specifically or containers generally? What’s the problem and what’s your preferred solution?
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