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GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

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Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#781

Post by digbyloftus »

humanrebar wrote: post #773
morgante wrote: post #653

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> "the right to free speak only protects you against the government" I strongly agree with that statement, but I also strongly object to the ouster of Eich. An opinion on one does not imply an opinion on the other. I support the right of the KKK to march through the streets, but that doesn't mean I should have to hire one of their members.

> I support the right of the KKK to march through the streets, but that doesn't mean I should have to hire one of their members. That's not the analogy. It's contrived, but to stick with the theme of white racists, is it ethical (legality aside) for a board full of clansmen to fire a CEO that donated to the ADL? To keep it simple, let's say the CEO is not Jewish, but does financially support the ADL.

Of course it is. Why wouldn't it be? They can fire him for any or no reason and it's completely ethical. They don't owe him employment.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#782

Post by humanrebar »

KirinDave wrote: post #538
mjolk wrote: post #500

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How do bad interview processes prove that meritocracy doesn't work?

You cannot prove meritocracy doesn't work. Fortunately you don't have to. The burden of proof is required for positive claims. We don't have a lot of evidence meritocracy works. We have several pieces of evidence suggesting that it, in fact, didn't serve github very well. The fact there was a sexual harassment lawsuit with a barely kept secret about a whole group of women bound by arbitration and non-disparage agreem…

> The burden of proof is required for positive claims.

Any positive claim is a negative claim and vice-versa. That also means positive claims are often contradictory.

1. Diversity should be considered along with merits when hiring.

2. Merit should be the overriding concern when hiring.

3. Extra precautions should be taken to promote a "blind" application and vetting process.

There's not enough proof to close the discussion, but we still have to hire people.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#783

Post by generic_user »

hox wrote: post #766
generic_user wrote: post #762

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, as a life long White Man who likes football and hot dogs, and it somewhat fat I agree with you 100%. Radical anti Male Feminism and Euro phobic racism are wonderful things for everyone. And there good for the economy. Just like you, I will continue to watch the glorious Television programming.

Do you seriously think most of this is based in straight-up hatred of white males? Every time I read something like was in the article, I view it as representative of what the author feels every day . God forbid we feel that way for 5 seconds before we throw it away.

Perceived grievances with the unfairness of the world do not entitle you to scapegoat other people or groups. This language is strikingly similar to to the dehumanisation of the Jews (as a race) in the public sphere in the 1920's and 30's after economic collapse and people were looking for a villein. Once you demonize a group as pure unredeemable evil its a short step to advocating physical violence as moral good to eliminate such evil form the world.

These are very dangerous ideas that are being thrown around.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#784

Post by jp_sc »

exolymph wrote: post #440
proc0 wrote: post #379

I would expect more from a tech company that is supposed to be by programmers for programmers. Programmers are abstract thinkers, and it's disgusting to see them lower themselves and adopt the semantics and memes of obvious cultural constructs like race. What does it even mean to be "white"? Who exactly are they talking about and what is it about this group of people that is so bad? There's no need to bring in this g…

"We need to start learning how to simply NOT THINK about race, and NOT MENTION IT." We live in a world where this is not remotely possible. Suggesting it is the worst sort of idealism.

> We live in a world where this is not remotely possible

No, you live in a COUNTRY where that seems not remotely possible.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#785

Post by [deleted] »

bmh_ca wrote: post #474
verylongaccount wrote: post #345

It seems that a large number of posters believe that discriminating against white men is okay because they enjoy "white privilege", whatever that is. Either you believe it is okay to discriminate against someone on the basis of their skin color or you don't. Attempts to redefine the word notwithstanding, those who subscribe to the former philosophy are known as racists. It is hard to distinguish the anti-white vitrio…

> Either you believe it is okay to discriminate against someone on the basis of their skin color or you don't. In most anti-discrimination policy discussions, the question being asked is not what colour ones skin is. It is whether the person belongs to an identifiable group that has suffered systemic prejudice. The ordinary intention of anti-discrimination is to rectify past and prevent future wrongs, and in particul…

[deleted]

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#786

Post by rashkov »

malandrew wrote: post #328
hitekker wrote: post #295

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wasn't aware of this history. One thing to note is the sentence that precedes 'reverse'-ism: >Our open source community prioritizes marginalized people’s safety over privileged people’s comfort. We will not act on complaints regarding: > ‘Reverse’ -isms, including ‘reverse racism,’ ‘reverse sexism,’ and ‘cisphobia’ Coded language for sanctioned discrimination.

It also fails to understand and accommodate intersectionality needs with respect to cognitive diversity. Related reading: Tact Filter: http://www.mit.edu/~jcb/tact.html Ozark English: http://ozarque.livejournal.com/176349.html When Nerds Collide: https://medium.com/@maradydd/when-nerds-collide-31895b01e68c

Thanks for the great reads and a fresh perspective (to me)

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#787

Post by humanrebar »

b6 wrote: post #658
canistr wrote: post #173

Hold on. Before we make judgment based solely on mentioning race in a slide. I highly recommend reading Nicole Sanchez's full take on the issue here: http://www.usatoday.com/story/tech/columnist/2015/02/12/wome...

Thanks, good idea. I read it. To me it seems saturated with the insidious mutant form of racism and sexism that I've been very worried about.

Yeah, in her coda, "be honest" and have "uncomfortable conversations" read more like, "let's end the conversation and agree with me".

These comments are a conversation. I'll take it in good faith that people are being honest. But I doubt that Ms. Sanchez has this in mind:

"We refuse to accept the current paradigms that reflect rather than challenge the status quo..."

So you want to have an honest conversation about how you're refusing to accept the status quo?

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#788

Post by [deleted] »

captain_jamira wrote: post #780
said wrote: post #626

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Holy bejeebus, people are defensive as all getup about this. WTF, people?!? It should be very easy to understand why people are upset about this. > Do people think that the quote, "...it is very hard to even interview people who are 'white'..." is about the difficulty this person finds in sitting in a room across from a white person, chatting with him? I understood it to be a perception on this person's part that t…

great story bro. I get it, you took offense to me taking 'devil's advocate' - look, it was just a figure of speech and I don't want to discriminate against your sensitive sense of fairness, so we'll split it; I'll take the figurative half and you can keep the literal half that you've already claimed. but seriously, you're use of unattributed quotes is confusing. Is this supposed to be cited material or something you…

[deleted]

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#789

Post by dang »

owlee wrote: post #679
said wrote: post #626

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Holy bejeebus, people are defensive as all getup about this. WTF, people?!? It should be very easy to understand why people are upset about this. > Do people think that the quote, "...it is very hard to even interview people who are 'white'..." is about the difficulty this person finds in sitting in a room across from a white person, chatting with him? I understood it to be a perception on this person's part that t…

Well put. What a disgusting person Nicole Sanchez is. Hopefully the next company will know better than to hire someone so destructive.

Personal attacks are not allowed on Hacker News. Please don't do this again.

Re: GitHub is undergoing a full-blown overhaul as execs and employees depart

#790

Post by sdesol »

jasonlotito wrote: post #709
djKianoosh wrote: post #290

Earlier quoted context omitted.

bitbucket server (used to be called stash) has practically no search capability. it's the underappreciated killer feature of github IMO

> has practically no search capability. it's the underappreciated killer feature of github IMO I honestly have to ask: have you used GitHub Enterprise? It's search functionality is horrible. Oh, it searches for things, but it won't find things. And this isn't a rare issue. And I'm not talking about anything other than searching through master branches. It's a tool that I cannot trust.

Just an FYI. GitHub's Enterprise search will get significantly better once I'm able to integrate my search technology with it. You can learn more about the search technology here:

http://gitsense.github.io/

Searching is done at the branch level and you'll have niceties like case sensitive searches and you'll be able to search across multiple branches at once to verify bug fixes and what not. It also introduces commits and diffs search, which are currently not possible with GitHub. And once again, these searches are at the branch level.

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