771–780 of 1001 posts
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Here's the difference though - Israel is an ally of the United States while Iran is a sworn enemy that has killed thousands of Americans since the 1979 revolution and routinely chants "Death to America". So, not equivalent.
They're both enemies to the US. If anything Israel is a more realistic threat at home.
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Not at all obviously. Israel is committing a genocide. This is not really a matter of discussion... you think several parts of the UN, Amnesty International, Doctors Without Borders, the international association of genocide scholars, the international federation for human rights, Human Rights Watch, the Hague Group, the governments of Ghana, Malaysia, Mexico, China, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Spain, Ireland, (and doze…
> Not at all obviously. Israel is committing a genocide. This is not really a matter of discussion... you think several parts of the UN, Amnesty International, Doctors Without Borders, the international association of genocide scholars, the international federation for human rights, Human Rights Watch, the Hague Group, the governments of Ghana, Malaysia, Mexico, China, Brazil, Chile, Colombia, Spain, Ireland, (and do…
> Because they would be the ones to know?[1]
> [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Persecution_of_Uyghurs_in_Chin...
Just so I understand correctly, are you implying here that you consider the persecution of Uyghurs a genocide?
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Not by a single lunatic operating from their bedroom.
"Back in my day Walter Cronkite told the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth about the Gulf of Tonkin incident" (never mind the fact that he didn't even have the full truth available to him but you get the point)
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> The existence of the support for those extremists has the same root cause that I stated in my original message: the artificial and strategic neocolonial state propped up by outside financial support with the expressed goal of establishing an ethnostate that eventually led to apartheid. Do you attribute Palestinian support for extremism to a similar root cause? Opinion polling indicates the extremism problem is far…
> Do you attribute Palestinian support for extremism to a similar root cause? Yes. But we typically don't call oppressed peoples "extremists". For example, I wouldn't call those who rebelled in the Warsaw Ghetto "extremists". I wouldn't call a 14 year old boy who has only known struggle his whole life under apartheid an "extremist". Apartheid also has had a lasting effect on oppressor / oppressed dynamics in South Af…
Many groups are oppressed to various degrees for various reasons but restoring to terrorism(especially against civilians) is arguably an extremist response. The two are not mutually exclusive.
> For example, I wouldn't call those who rebelled in the Warsaw Ghetto "extremists".
They were being exterminated. I don't recall there being much terrorism targeting German civilians during that rebellion either.
> I wouldn't call a 14 year old boy who has only known struggle his whole life under apartheid an "extremist".
It's not oppression that would make one an extremist, it would be for example holding extremist views such as the supporting of terrorist attacks against civilians. One can teach extremist views to a 14 year old boy, in fact it's often much easier to teach extremist views to children than to adults.
> Calling everything one disagrees with "virtue signalling" is a tired trope.
Advocating for more condemnation without proposing actual solutions is rather pointless unless your end goal is endless war.
> There is no solution that will occur in our lifetimes, because there is no benevolent and omnipotent authority that can snap their magic finger and cease the suffering that's occurring because of this apartheid ethnostate.
So we should just give up and advocate for policies that will clearly never lead to peace? Also an occupation is not the same as apartheid. Apartheid is race based discrimination while the situation with Israel/Palestine falls mostly under the category of citizenship based discrimination(which most countries practice to various degrees).
> With my suggestion, I'm trying to prevent the next ethnostate disaster. Ideally, I would want our descendants to recoil in disgust when thinking of the concept of funding an ethnostate in the same way that we recoil in disgust at the concept of funding a sex trafficking ring. I will teach my children, and my children's children, that "A State for [] People" is disgusting, no matter what [] is - unless it is "A State for All People".
The middle east is full of ethnostates, compared to most states in the region Israel does reasonably well at protecting the rights of minority ethnicity citizens.
> South Africa was once an apartheid state, and it continues to exist.
Sure, but I don't think black South Africans were advocating for the destruction of South Africa as a state during apartheid.
> Similarly, ethnostates need to find ways to transition away from being ethnostates.
How do you propose states do that? Israel is clearly never going to give Palestinians full citizenship when the Palestinians at large do not believe in equal rights.
> If only I could trust the state of Israel to actually design a "heavy handed approach" that wasn't rape, pillage, murder, and terrorize.
So should a different country or organization be trying to de-radicalize Palestinians?
> I could never imagine the state of Israel allowing a Palestinian to testify against an Israeli soldier who raped them. Not yet, at least.
Israel has allowed for testimony from Palestinians in cases to some degree AFAIU but I don't think simply being allowed to give testimony is really the main issue here. The real issues are more tied to the way justice is administered, systematic double standards and the way military law is applied to non-citizens. The lack of any sort of final peace agreement between Israel and Palestine is what perpetuates this system however.
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> There's no such thing: the separate authority in Gaza was produced by Israeli military isolation of the separate parts of Palestine nominally administered by the PA, and how that facilitated Hamas local victory there in the intra-Palestinian civil war against the central government. The election that brought Hamas to power in Gaza was widely considered to be free and fair.[0] > Also, the elections that were won by…
A lot of Jews in the Polish Ghettos were pretty extremist.
The Jews in the Warsaw Ghetto Uprising were not going around killing German civilians.
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Sure, criticism of NATO is always pro-Russian disinfo. Just as with Israel and being antiseptic.
Israel has carried out a massively destructive war of aggression against civilians, and NATO .. hasn't.
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Why would israelis ever agree to give up control of their government? They hold all the cards here, any solution will have to be one that favors israel because the status quo is just fine for them
Not if the US backs out or otherwise changes its stance
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don't be ridiculous. feel free to point to Democrats with clear evidence of anyi semitic statements and connections to right wing nationalists. then let's tally up the same count for the GOP eh (Nock Fuentes at the white house, "you shall not replace us", etc). There is very little jew hatred on the left. just fatogue with unlimited aupport for a Israeli regime that is losing democratic and moral support due to it's.…
> evidence of anyi semitic statements and connections to right wing nationalists Why the "and" there? The anti-semites on the left are of course... of the left. > There is very little jew hatred on the left Your head is in the sand. Leftists on the street shouting genocide of the jews ("from the river to the sea") is like a monthly thing. They started before Israel entered Gaza. Before .