I can’t imagine releasing an app and then shaming my users into tweaking about:config
Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
771–780 of 834 posts
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#772Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which unit is the fun game that gets played. I've seen way to many products right beside each other that use different measurements.
Most people will have devices that can easily convert measurements to the desired unit.
Oh fun, now I can invest even more time and energy into grocery shopping.
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#773Earlier quoted context omitted.
It means that the colors should be correct. The sky on tv should look like the sky. The grass on tv should look like grass. If I look at the screen and then I look outside, it should look the same. HDR screens and sensors are getting pretty close, but almost everyone is using color grading so the advantage is gone. And after colors, don't get me started about motion and the 24fps abomination.
White walls in my kitchen look different depending on the time of day and weather, and that’s before I turn on the lights. What is the correct colour?
Well, I know what you mean, color is complicated. BUT, I can look at a hundred skys and they look like sky. I will look at the sky on the tv, and it looks like sky on the tv, not like the real sky. And sky is probably easy to replicate, but if you take the grass or leaves, or human skin, then the tv becomes funny most of the time.
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#774Earlier quoted context omitted.
> To preempt replies: ask yourself why 24 frames per second is optimal for cinema instead of just being an ancient spec that everyone got used to. "Everyone" includes the filmmakers. And in those cases where the best filmmakers already found all kinds of artistic workarounds for the lower framerate in the places that mattered, adding interpolation will fuck up their films. For example, golden age animators did their…
Agreed, the idea that there’s anything “objective” about art is kind of hilarious. Yes, it may be technically better in that there are more frames but does it make a more enjoyable film?
It's not kind of hilarious, it's actually the default mode of thinking for the entirety of human culture until the mid twentieth century. Thousands of years of great thinkers would have found the postmodern idea that all art is subjective to be, if not hilarious, then disturbing in its wrongness.
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#775Earlier quoted context omitted.
Which unit is the fun game that gets played. I've seen way to many products right beside each other that use different measurements.
Most people will have devices that can easily convert measurements to the desired unit.
That same device can also calculate the unit price (since you know price & weight), so why even print it, right?
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#776Earlier quoted context omitted.
What does “like reality” mean?
It means that the colors should be correct. The sky on tv should look like the sky. The grass on tv should look like grass. If I look at the screen and then I look outside, it should look the same. HDR screens and sensors are getting pretty close, but almost everyone is using color grading so the advantage is gone. And after colors, don't get me started about motion and the 24fps abomination.
> It means that the colors should be correct. The sky on tv should look like the sky. The grass on tv should look like grass.
It is not as clear cut as you think and is very much a gradient. I could send 10 different color gradings of the sky and grass to 10 different people and they could all say it looks “natural” to them, or a few would say it looks “off,” because our expectations of “natural” looks are not informed by any sort of objective rubric. Naturally if everyone says it’s off the common denominator is likely the colorist, but aside from that, the above generally holds. It’s why color grading with proper scopes and such is so important. You’re doing your best to meet the expectation for as many people as possible knowing that they will be looking on different devices, have different ideas of what a proper color is, are in different environments, etc. and ultimately you will still disappoint some folks. There are so many hardware factors at play stacked on top of an individual’s own expectations.
Even the color of the room you’re in or the color/intensity of the light in your peripheral vision will heavily influence how you perceive a color that is directly in front of you. Even if you walk around with a proper color reference chart checking everything it’s just always going to have a subjective element because you have your own opinion of what constitutes green grass.
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#777The fact that I have to turn on closed captioning to understand anything tells me these producers have no idea what we want and shouldn’t be telling us what settings to use.
Don’t blame the producer blame your av setup with a lack of separation
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#778Earlier quoted context omitted.
If TV settings offend you, you should be offended by anyone watching anything made for movie theater on a TV or iPad or - gasp - a phone, regardless of settings. And it should be offensive to watch with the lights on or windows open. ;) To be fair, 24p is crap. You know and agree with that, right? Horizontal pans in 24p are just completely unwatchable garbage, verticals aren’t that much better, action sequences in 24…
If you’re noticing stuttering on 24fps pans then someone made a mistake when setting the shutter speed (they set it too fast), the motion blur should have smoothed it out. This is an error on the cinematographer’s fault more than anything. 60fps will always look like cheap soap opera to me for movies.
Pans looking juddery no matter what you do in 24 fps is a very well known issue. Motion blur’s ability to help (using the 180-shutter rule) is quite limited, and you can also reduce it somewhat by going very slow (using the 1/7 frame rule), but there is no cure. The cinematographer cannot fix the fundamental physical problem of the 24 fps framerate being too slow.
24 fps wasn’t chosen because it was optimal or high quality, it was chosen because it’s the cheapest option for film that meets the minimum rate needed to not degrade into a slideshow and also sync with audio.
Here’s an example that uses the 180-shutter and 1/7-frame rules and still demonstrates bad judder. “We have tried the obvious motion blur which should have been able to handle it but even with feature turned on, it still happens. Motion blur applied to other animations, fine… but with horizontal scroll, it doesn’t seem to affect it.” https://creativecow.net/forums/thread/horizontal-panning-ani...
Even with the rules of thumb, “images will not immediately become unwatchable faster than seven seconds, nor will they become fully artifact-free when panning slower than this limit”. https://www.red.com/red-101/camera-panning-speed
The thing I personally started to notice and now can’t get over is that during a horizontal pan, even with a slow speed and the prescribed amount of motion blur, I can’t see any details or track small objects smoothly. In the animation clip attached to that creativecow link, try watching the faces or look at any of the text or small objects in the scene. You can see that they’re there, but you can’t see any detail during the pan. Apologies in advance if I ruin your ability to watch pans in 24fps. I used to be fine with them, but I truly can’t stand them anymore. The pans didn’t change, but I did become more aware and more critical.
> 60fps will always look like cheap soap opera to me for movies
Probably me too, but there seems to be some evidence and hypothesizing that this is a learned effect because we grew up with 24p movies. The kids don’t get the same effect because they didn’t grow up with it, and I’ve heard that it’s also less pronounced for people who grew up watching PAL rather than NTSC. TVs with smoothing on are curing the next generation from being stuck with 24 fps.
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#779Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, I think that this is one place to be very bullish on AI content creation. There are many people with fantastic visions for beautiful stories that they will never be in a position to create the traditional way; oftentimes with better stories than what is actually produced officially. (You ever think about how many fantastic riffs have been wasted with cringe lyrics?)
Nothing is stopping you right now from buying or finding or creating a catalog of loops and samples that you can use to create your own Artistic Vision[tm]. The technology exists and has existed for decades, no AI required.
I saw that one of my favourite electronic artists, BT, has embraced AI by making a ton of his own loops and samples and then training the AI on it so that it makes more of his music for him.
Re: Stranger Things creator says turn off “garbage” settings
#780Earlier quoted context omitted.
Yes, I think that this is one place to be very bullish on AI content creation. There are many people with fantastic visions for beautiful stories that they will never be in a position to create the traditional way; oftentimes with better stories than what is actually produced officially. (You ever think about how many fantastic riffs have been wasted with cringe lyrics?)
i often think about all the music ruined by self obsessed dorks singing soulless middle school poetry, and it's the main application of AI i'm quite excited for
Absolutely! Is there a name for the opposite of a "remix" - where you'd normally have the same lyrics but change the music - and instead keep the beautiful original music but put something a little more meaningful over it?
Ever look at the lyrics to Toto's Africa? We can start there, someone send a poet please