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Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

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Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#771

Post by Muromec »

deltarholamda wrote: post #225
powvans wrote: post #10

This is really amazing to see trending on HN. I spent a couple days in Pontevedra this summer while walking the Camino de Santiago. It was absolutely delightful and what I experienced aligns with the article. The old town was filled with wide streets almost exclusively for walking, cafes and restaurants that sprawled into plazas, and people young and old enjoying the car free public space. It was one of the first sto…

>Where it exists you can see that there is tremendous demand for it. Everybody loves public transit until they get panhandled for the jillionth time, or they witness (or experience) violence, or some other anti-social behavior sours the whole thing. I spent some time in NYC during the Giuliani years, after the city did a lot of work cleaning it all up: stopping turnstile jumpers, removing graffiti, more police, etc.…

>Everybody loves public transit until they get panhandled for the jillionth time, or they witness (or experience) violence, or some other anti-social behavior sours the whole thing.

Haven't seen any of that in 30 years of using public transport in several countries. Are you ok in US?

The closest to anarchy I have been in public transport was withnessin a hobo refusing to pay for the ride to trigger the police response and be booked.

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#772

Post by oblio »

mothballed wrote: post #672
piva00 wrote: post #660

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think it has anything to do with free speech laws, it's simply civics and the lack of it in American society due to a multitude of factors. American society doesn't understand collectivism in any level, your country has been built upon individualism without much care for collective living, you just reap what you've sown.

Have you considered that America is a wealthy country, where anyone with a job even flipping burgers can buy a 150cc motorcycle and then take his girl on a date without a process that involves getting accosted by a paranoid schizophrenic? You can basically buy a small motorcycle or scooter or fast e-bike on credit for the cost of maintaining a bus pass. It's only a rational choice for elderly or people with such ment…

If the US builds high density corridors supported by high frequency, reliable public transit connecting desirable destinations (housing with shopping, CBDs, etc), I'm willing to bet a lot that every social class will be represented on those public transit lines.

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#773

Post by gs17 »

Saline9515 wrote: post #531
GeoAtreides wrote: post #509

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Man, you really public transportation, you've been all over this thread sniping every positive comment about public transportation

I love quality public transportation. The problem is that most of the time people make cities less car-friendly, but don't improve public transport, as it's expensive and their electorate wants bike lanes, making the situation worse for everyone. In my city, they removed the parking space near the farmer's market, but didn't add any bus line or renovate the tram, which doesn't allow disabled people or just strollers…

> The problem is that most of the time people make cities less car-friendly, but don't improve public transport,

That's my complaint too. We've added plenty of things to make driving worse where I am, but there's no real alternative presented. I can walk a mile to a bus stop in the sun where the bus may or may not show up for an hour (they promise they will improve it eventually) and will then drop me off somewhere I still have to walk most of a mile from. They made the road to the bus stop a bit worse to walk on and I gave up.

I would love to not have to drive. But I'm not really given the option, I'm just given less parking so that there's a nice bike lane I can jump into when someone comes barrelling down the sidewalk.

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#774

Post by Muromec »

deltarholamda wrote: post #394
Fricken wrote: post #338

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My daily bicycle commute takes me right through the heart of my city's homeless district, and like with many cities things have gotten a lot worse since COVID. Cars are far and away the biggest threat to my safety, and the source of all the harrassment I receive while out in public. I mean, every now and then some guttersnipe blurts out incoherencies at me, but that's not something to be afraid of. I regard driving,…

Do you have a wife? Kids? Would you let them bicycle through the homeless district? I don't get hassled either, but it's not about me. My job as a husband and father is to protect my family.

I for once don't let mine out of the house without a full face cover so strangers on the street don't get any ideas, so I'm right there with you.

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#775

Post by randunel »

pjmlp wrote: post #679
randunel wrote: post #291

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Show me a city which banned personal cars and we'll check whether P+R transit to anywhere within is 2h. You can't, because there is no such city. It's personal cars that slow down transit, including preventing new rails being built to not dismay cherished drivers.

Pity that such miracle cities don't exist for people living in the suburbs, with their 4x connections on average, from door to door.

Indeed, such a city would prove you lot wrong.

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#776

Post by oblio »

everdrive wrote: post #537
deltarholamda wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Where it exists you can see that there is tremendous demand for it. Everybody loves public transit until they get panhandled for the jillionth time, or they witness (or experience) violence, or some other anti-social behavior sours the whole thing. I spent some time in NYC during the Giuliani years, after the city did a lot of work cleaning it all up: stopping turnstile jumpers, removing graffiti, more police, etc.…

>The worst argument anybody can make is "but that's just life in the big city!" A cousin was visiting us in our nice suburb. We had a slow, not-busy road we walked on when we lived there, and we'd wave to anyone; neighbors, vehicles, etc. Our cousin was sort of uncomfortable, and asked "do you know all these people?" I explained that we knew some of them but were just being polite and friendly. She explained that tha…

> She explained that that were she lived (Boston) you just couldn't safely wave at just anybody you passed.

I was born and raised in urban environments.

Let me translate this for rural (or fake rural aka suburbia) minded folks:

In cities people don't wave except to people they actually know/have seen several times because...

It's gauche, awkward, weird.

There are just too many people in cities and nobody can pretend their city is just one big village. People just go on with their lives and don't wave 1 million times per day. Waving is reserved to actual acquaintances.

In this specific case, it was most likely a bad neighborhood or someone with a heightened sense of fear due to reasons that cannot be clarified without knowing the person directly.

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#777

Post by starik36 »

rcpt wrote: post #480
deltarholamda wrote: post #225

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Where it exists you can see that there is tremendous demand for it. Everybody loves public transit until they get panhandled for the jillionth time, or they witness (or experience) violence, or some other anti-social behavior sours the whole thing. I spent some time in NYC during the Giuliani years, after the city did a lot of work cleaning it all up: stopping turnstile jumpers, removing graffiti, more police, etc.…

> Everybody loves public transit until they get panhandled for the jillionth time OP is right. The demand is huge and supply is tiny. Even with those scary panhandlers people are jamming onto public transport (when it actually exists) and going far far out of their way to experience walkable areas. > zero other options if I want to live where crime is low and the schools aren't dysfunctional Crime in NYC is exceeding…

Just rented a 2 bedroom on the Upper West Side. The rent is $4600 a month. And these bedrooms are tiny.

Not everyone can "simply move to" Upper West Side.

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#778

Post by oblio »

SilverElfin wrote: post #630
oldjim798 wrote: post #300

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How is driving not emotionally taxing the exact same way? Driving with my kids is fucking terrifying. I have 2 under 6, and I have to lock them into these giant car seats to keep them safe (to be clear I like modern car seats, their designs just remind me how vulnerable kids are). Every time I go through a intersection I worry what happens if someone runs the red and smashes into our side. I no longer speed when I dr…

> Every time I go through an intersection I worry what happens if someone runs the red and smashes into our side. Something like this is a lot more rare than harassment on public transit. And not exactly avoidable. So it isn’t worth thinking about. But on public transit you have to maintain constant vigilance just to avoid the many bad situations that could come your way. You’re very exposed and vulnerable. The crime…

It's not just about crashes. It's also about close calls (in both directions, being hit and hitting others), people driving while checking their phones, rude drivers: tailgaters, honkers, high beamers, etc. The list is endless.

Oh, and my God, the mind numbing boredom.

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#779

Post by user94wjwuid »

deltarholamda wrote: post #225
powvans wrote: post #10

This is really amazing to see trending on HN. I spent a couple days in Pontevedra this summer while walking the Camino de Santiago. It was absolutely delightful and what I experienced aligns with the article. The old town was filled with wide streets almost exclusively for walking, cafes and restaurants that sprawled into plazas, and people young and old enjoying the car free public space. It was one of the first sto…

>Where it exists you can see that there is tremendous demand for it. Everybody loves public transit until they get panhandled for the jillionth time, or they witness (or experience) violence, or some other anti-social behavior sours the whole thing. I spent some time in NYC during the Giuliani years, after the city did a lot of work cleaning it all up: stopping turnstile jumpers, removing graffiti, more police, etc.…

You are 1,000,000,000% more likely to die hit by a car as a pedestrian than die from a panhandler asking for a buck

Re: Pontevedra, Spain declares its entire urban area a "reduced traffic zone"

#780

Post by oblio »

piva00 wrote: post #653
MisterTea wrote: post #635

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was in Spain last month and what stood out is that walkability requires mom and pop stores as well as more integrated neighborhoods with small commercial shops mixed into residential. Small shops seemed to be the majority in the city centers. The only large store I saw was a Lidl. They have largeish indoor markets that are more like a mini mall of individual shops like a butcher, produce, baker, cheese, even restau…

> They have largeish indoor markets that are more like a mini mall of individual shops like a butcher, produce, baker, cheese, even restaurants and bars. It's very common all over Europe, they are simply called "markets".

Yeah, that's hilarious, that's what markets ARE. That's how they were created. Like, thousands of years ago.
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