Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Pope Francis has died

reuters.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

771–780 of 875 posts

Re: Pope Francis has died

#771

Post by make3 »

bmicraft wrote: post #666
skissane wrote: post #654

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It's quite a bit above our pay grade to proclaim categorically who supposedly cannot be redeemed; it verges on blasphemy. And the idea that atheists can be saved isn't novel in Catholic teaching – it is implicit in the Holy Office's 1949 condemnation of Feeneyism, [0] in which it declared that a person who doesn't believe in Catholicism due to "invincible ignorance" can be saved by an "implicit desire" for God. Alt…

> ... who doesn't believe in God in their head [..] but nonetheless believes in God in their heart ... I'm racking my brain right now dissecting what that even means. Believing there is no one but wishing it wasn't so?

if you're good but in your mind reject God, I guess they're saying that it's good enough

Re: Pope Francis has died

#772

Post by make3 »

jamesblonde wrote: post #59
CKMo wrote: post #45

I genuinely liked him, even as an atheist. He seemed to be trying his best to make the world a better place and I can't fault him for that.

Same here. Although I grew up a Catholic and am now an atheist, my father counselled me that there were few institutions in the world that look after the downtrodden. The Catholic church has often not done that, but under Francis moved more towards that goal than any other time in recent history.

this is terribly inaccurate. they teach gainst using birth control even in poor, AIDS ridden regions (see Mother Theresa in Africa), treat women as lesser beings (including not recognizing that marital rape is a thing), cause the mistreatment of queer and homosexual and trans people, etc etc

Re: Pope Francis has died

#773

Post by inemesitaffia »

make3 wrote: post #772
jamesblonde wrote: post #59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here. Although I grew up a Catholic and am now an atheist, my father counselled me that there were few institutions in the world that look after the downtrodden. The Catholic church has often not done that, but under Francis moved more towards that goal than any other time in recent history.

this is terribly inaccurate. they teach gainst using birth control even in poor, AIDS ridden regions (see Mother Theresa in Africa), treat women as lesser beings (including not recognizing that marital rape is a thing), cause the mistreatment of queer and homosexual and trans people, etc etc

Any Abrahamic religion that teaches otherwise isn't compatible with tradition or scripture period.

Also the condom thing is false. Keep up to date.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#774

Post by inemesitaffia »

kome wrote: post #144
yodsanklai wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> .. even as an atheist lots of christians didn't like him, considering he was too progressive

i saw this only on the internet tho, and mainly the english speaking internet, never in real life.

This just isn't true. Anyone who hangs around people who follow the church happenings would know even if they were in support of his actions.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#775

Post by FunnyUsername »

za3faran wrote: post #765
milesrout wrote: post #700

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

israel literally are able to cut off food, water, electricity, internet at their own whim, they're doing it as we speak. They are actively blocking aid and food from going in. Read the news. There are many anti-zionist jews as well speaking up against the atrocities and war crimes israel has been committing for a very long time now.

[flagged]

Re: Pope Francis has died

#776

Post by inemesitaffia »

shadowgovt wrote: post #770
za3faran wrote: post #765

Earlier quoted context omitted.

israel literally are able to cut off food, water, electricity, internet at their own whim, they're doing it as we speak. They are actively blocking aid and food from going in. Read the news. There are many anti-zionist jews as well speaking up against the atrocities and war crimes israel has been committing for a very long time now.

I'm not even sure I'd go so far as to call them anti-zionist. How long do people imagine Israel survives as a state with a brutally-oppressed population under its care? It's a rational position to be pro-state-of-Israel and want them to find peace (and integration) with the Gazans because the consequences of perpetual animosity and aggression are the single biggest threat to the state's survival.

[flagged]

Re: Pope Francis has died

#777

Post by inemesitaffia »

caseyy wrote: post #260
decimalenough wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's been much talk of the Church finally electing a black Pope from sub-Saharan Africa. The irony is that, if they are inclusive enough to do so, the selected Pope will almost certainly be more hard-line and doctrinaire than any of his recent predecessors on issues like homosexuality. Here's one of the contenders: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Sarah

Of the current widely accepted papabili, Peter Turkson is from Sub-Saharan Africa. He is softly pro-LGBT, and he seeks to harmonize the progressive homosexuality views with traditional African culture[0]. I don't think Robert Sarah is considered papabile, possibly owing to his message of hate for homosexuality. Overall, it's inconsistent with the recent message of the church, and it is hard to imagine that progressiv…

There's no reconciliation between living in sin and in Christ, period.

Anything outside that, regardless of how progressive it seems, is inconsistent with church teachings.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#778

Post by inemesitaffia »

lores wrote: post #294
caseyy wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of the current widely accepted papabili, Peter Turkson is from Sub-Saharan Africa. He is softly pro-LGBT, and he seeks to harmonize the progressive homosexuality views with traditional African culture[0]. I don't think Robert Sarah is considered papabile, possibly owing to his message of hate for homosexuality. Overall, it's inconsistent with the recent message of the church, and it is hard to imagine that progressiv…

Interesting that they identify mostly progressives as papabile. If they're right, Francis did an excellent job behind the scenes to set up the Church to do in the future what he could not in the present.

He's negatively affected church growth and that's stark.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#779

Post by inemesitaffia »

larkost wrote: post #635
rglullis wrote: post #479

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There’s that one line. And centuries of liberal democracies where the church was just one institution that had no direct rule over its subjects?

The word "direct" is carrying an awful lot of weight in that sentence. The Catholic Church (as well as the Protestant and others) are very responsible for, or at least implicated in, many horrible things in the last few hundred years alone: - signed off on the slave trade for hundreds of years (even gave excuses about how that was God's will) - during World War II they promised to hide many Jewish children, only to s…

As opposed to Islamic slave trade still existing in 2025? And I'm not talking about modern day slavery.

Re: Pope Francis has died

#780

Post by inemesitaffia »

wat10000 wrote: post #759
skissane wrote: post #723

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I prefer this over the nuts who decry Sharia law while wanting to implement a Christian equivalent. The idea of a "Christian equivalent" to Sharia law is actually very fringe. The near unanimous teaching of Christianity, from the Church Fathers through to the mainstream Reformers, is that the criminal laws in the Jewish Torah were only ever intended for Jews, and Christians are not bound by the letter of them – the…

This distinction might sound very important for people within one of those religions, but it sounds pretty trivial from the outside. Changing secular law to reflect religious law versus directly applying religious law, who cares? The result is the same. And for excessive focus, maybe you haven't noticed, but that fringe position is wielding a tremendous power in the country where I live at the moment.

It's not trivial for someone like me literarily living under Shari'a today.
Post reply on HN