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Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

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Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#771

Post by Ajedi32 »

lynx97 wrote: post #430
chamanbuga wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is cap. I worked on heads up glasses, and one of our issues was the lack of integration with Apple's iMessage ecosystem. Device makers are willing to go through several security measures, like deploying the MFi chips and certification. However, at best this gives you access to the notification system, not iMessage itself. You are able to respond to messages via the notification framework, but not integrate direc…

As a user, I am totally fine with Apple restricting access to iMessage. In fact, now that I read this, I want them to do this, thanks Apple.

This perspective is infuriating. It's literally Stockholm syndrome. Your device is being held prisoner in a cell that they refuse to give you the key to unlock no matter how much you beg, and you are actually thanking them for it.

How can you not realize that you're being abused?

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#772

Post by [deleted] »

Ajedi32 wrote: post #771
lynx97 wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a user, I am totally fine with Apple restricting access to iMessage. In fact, now that I read this, I want them to do this, thanks Apple.

This perspective is infuriating. It's literally Stockholm syndrome. Your device is being held prisoner in a cell that they refuse to give you the key to unlock no matter how much you beg, and you are actually thanking them for it. How can you not realize that you're being abused?

[deleted]

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#773

Post by FabHK »

smaudet wrote: post #718
lynx97 wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a user, I am totally fine with Apple restricting access to iMessage. In fact, now that I read this, I want them to do this, thanks Apple.

As a user, I'm not certain I completely agree. Yes, I don't want apps accessing my messages surreptitiously. Points there. However, what's wrong with allowing another app to post messages to my messages? If I don't want it, let me turn them off. Maybe, as a UI expert company, it's easy "block app from sending me messages" when I get a message. Seems like something that should be fairly transparent to the (potentially…

> what's wrong with allowing another app to post messages to my messages?

That's exactly what spammers would use to send spam.

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#774

Post by jeroenhd »

crazygringo wrote: post #538
rednafi wrote: post #139

There's nothing new here. From AirDrop to AirPods, Apple's MO is to lock you into their ecosystem and be as belligerent as possible toward any non-Apple gizmo. Couple that with social and network effects, and you have a perfect formula for monopolizing a market without continuously improving the tech.

> and you have a perfect formula for monopolizing a market without continuously improving the tech. ...but the Apple ecosystem has the best tech. M chips, AirPods Pro, Apple Watch, iPad, Pencil, I mean the tech is great . Apple isn't monopolizing anything. They're competing like hell and winning because their tech is best. The real question is why the Android and Microsoft ecosystems don't do better at improving thei…

Best individual hardware components perhaps, but their software is shit enough that I don't consider their tech to be best. macOS and its weird limitations are enough for me to accept Windows 11 before I'll buy an Apple laptop.

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#775

Post by 1propionyl »

Ajedi32 wrote: post #771
lynx97 wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a user, I am totally fine with Apple restricting access to iMessage. In fact, now that I read this, I want them to do this, thanks Apple.

This perspective is infuriating. It's literally Stockholm syndrome. Your device is being held prisoner in a cell that they refuse to give you the key to unlock no matter how much you beg, and you are actually thanking them for it. How can you not realize that you're being abused?

Different people evaluate cost/benefit trade offs differently than you do, and don't speak of the matter with metaphorically charged terminology like "abuse", "prison", "Stockholm syndrome", etc.

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#776

Post by cameldrv »

lynx97 wrote: post #430
chamanbuga wrote: post #191

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is cap. I worked on heads up glasses, and one of our issues was the lack of integration with Apple's iMessage ecosystem. Device makers are willing to go through several security measures, like deploying the MFi chips and certification. However, at best this gives you access to the notification system, not iMessage itself. You are able to respond to messages via the notification framework, but not integrate direc…

As a user, I am totally fine with Apple restricting access to iMessage. In fact, now that I read this, I want them to do this, thanks Apple.

It's tricky. As a long time Apple user, I appreciate that they are privacy focused, but I also get a lot of spam text messages, calls, and notifications. It's become more and more annoying to deal with these on my Garmin watch and on my phone. I wish I had some sort of AI filter. For example, I want to get a notification if my Uber is running late, but I don't want one if Uber is offering me 20% off if I subscribe to whatever their monthly service is.

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#777

Post by vFunct »

tremon wrote: post #364
Retric wrote: post #216

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Every device you let in is another attack surface, and no certification process can eliminate it. Allowing devices to view and respond to messages is inherently lower risk than allowing them to freely communicate with anyone.

You do realize this is a very infantilizing attitude? Why can't the end user choose its own level of security vs usability? Letting a corporation decide this for all users is just creating a nanny state in different clothing.

Because the end user aren't computer scientists. End users should have NO capability in determining their own security, since they could LITERALLY BE infants playing with the iPad.

It is the responsibility of the systems designer to make sure the system is secure, not the end user.

And if you require instructions on how to secure your system, then you have already failed. A properly designed system is secure with zero knowledge.

Remember, it takes work to learn anything, and the goal of a tool is to reduce work, not to increase it.

Throw away customization. Throw away configuration. Both of those are bad design principles.

Make it work by default.

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#778

Post by VogonPoetry »

protimewaster wrote: post #762
fastball wrote: post #748

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not sure you understand the argument. If you allow people the ability to access iMessage however they want, how do you prevent iMessage spam? You may not care about this, but a lot of people do.

Can't you already send iMessage spam using Apple Script on Mac? Would it be that much worse if it was also possible from iPhone? Also, I'm pretty sure you can just set up a click farm to spam from iPhone right now, so there's also that.

It isn't easy to do with just AppleScript on a Mac. I run a sports team and I wanted to send out a message to people for special situations. Some of the challenges are that you cannot script sending a new message if there isn't already a thread -and- it seems like you must use the same contact info (email or phone number). There isn't much feedback when it goes wrong. Some of these do make sense for preventing spam. I suspect I could have used the accessibility APIs to drive the UI. I eventually gave up.

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#779

Post by Aaargh20318 »

bigyabai wrote: post #441
lynx97 wrote: post #430

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a user, I am totally fine with Apple restricting access to iMessage. In fact, now that I read this, I want them to do this, thanks Apple.

You can thank Apple for the Lightning connector and App Store too, for all the good it does everyone in the EU. If a company uses their power to prevent competition with their own products or services, the market's jurisdiction reserves the right to restore competition to their market and prevent the harms inherent to monopoly abuse.

> You can thank Apple for the Lightning connector and App Store too

The App Store was an absolute revolution for mobile app developers. It is hard to overstate how much of an improvement it was over the status quo. People are complaining about Apple taking a 30% cut; it used to be that the operators took a 70% cut. Not for hosting an app store, no, just for sending the reverse-billing SMS message with the install link. You had to host it yourself, there was no store so you had to advertise your app to make it discoverable. You had to arrange (and pay for) a shortcode and SMS provider for every single country you wanted to sell in. You had to write and host code to handle the incoming message on the shortcode and respond with a RB-SMS.

Next to that, the SDK’s were absolute dogshit, phone manufacturers didn’t give a shit about apps and the phones themselves were riddled with bugs (with the notable exception of SonyEricsson, their J2ME environment was excellent). Symbian was a PITA to develop for, BlackBerry was actively developer-hostile (unless you happened to be a Fortune-500 company). Samsung phones were an absolute disaster, every single phone model had a unique set of bugs you had to find workarounds for.

So in comes Apple, they charge only 30% and for that you get a nice SDK, an App Store that distributes your app, makes it discoverable and handles payments worldwide with zero extra effort. We were thrilled when they announced it, and rightfully so.

Google then followed suit with the Play Store, effectively matching what Apple was doing.

So yeah, Apple deserves some thanks for what they did with the App Store.

Re: Apple restricts Pebble from being awesome with iPhones

#780

Post by xigoi »

darkwater wrote: post #504
usrusr wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In defense of the "it's security!" position (which is not mine): I think they mean a similar vulnerability could exist on the client side of the API. As in someone sends manipulated media that targets a vulnerability on the third party device, the media gets forwarded through the API, now that compromised third party device does bad things over the API. Personally, I think that it's really just a convenient third par…

Following that line of reasoning, the Apple should ban WhatsApp and other messaging systems because they can add potential vulnerabilities.

Don’t give them ideas!
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