Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

wsj.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

771–780 of 1001 posts

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#771

Post by dctoedt »

rayiner wrote: post #761
Kim_Bruning wrote: post #747

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ah, ok, it's a red line for you. Good that you make that explicit, but you are being a thrifty with information there. This site is for curious conversation, so I'd love to see you elucidate a bit further! What's the nature of the red line? For instance, Are you worried they'd get hurt? Are you worried about political implications? Or, does the fact that there are already American volunteers to fighting in Ukraine ch…

I don’t want the U.S. to bear the cost (in money and lives) of a war that doesn’t directly relate to protecting the american homeland. I think U.S. foreign policy has been a failure since the 1950s—we shouldn’t have gone to war in Korea, Vietnam, Kuwait, Iraq, etc. The only justifiable war in that time, in my opinion, was Afghanistan, where the Taliban harbored terrorists that had attacked the U.S. I think the premis…

> I don’t want the U.S. to bear the cost (in money and lives) of a war that doesn’t directly relate to protecting the american homeland. I think U.S. foreign policy has been a failure since the 1950s—we shouldn’t have gone to war in Korea, Vietnam, Kuwait, Iraq, etc.

Why don't you run for office on a platform that "Pax Americana was a huge mistake!"

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#772

Post by codedokode »

CapricornNoble wrote: post #653
sireat wrote: post #316

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As someone living in the Baltics, most people here are fully aware that when Putin chooses to attack we would have trouble holding the mythical 72 hours for full NATO help to arrive. If NATO help is not coming it is over quite quickly. You have to remember that Ukraine has/had 40 million population, Baltics has about 7 million. We also do not have the miles of mined out defenses that Ukraine has had since 2014. We do…

Look at your situation from a different perspective: the Baltics have ~3 times the population of Gaza, and at the very least something resembling air defenses. Gaza was bombed into rubble but the governing body still exists. Or you have roughly the same population as Lebanon, where Hezbollah completely stymied the IDF ground offensive (they wanted to force Hezbollah north of the Litani) even after paralyzing Hezbolla…

In 1939 if I remember correctly, USSR captured Baltic countries in a matter of days.

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#773

Post by lovich »

nanotuber wrote: post #755
lovich wrote: post #609

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Biden also negotiated a deal which put refined nuclear material in Australia's hands http://npr.org/2023/03/13/1163153801/biden-is-selling-u-s-nu...

This is nuclear powered (long range) submarines.

Yea, and he managed to get the Australians to switch from a nearly done deal with the French to our subs, and we used highly enriched uranium as fuel.

In a thread about Japan being a screwdriver turn away from having nukes, I think that a highly industrialized state getting handed a fuck ton of highly enriched uranium falls into the same category.

I mean, look at all the sabotage we’ve done to Iran in the form of sanctions or actual sabotage like Stuxnet just to stop their uranium enrichment facilities

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#774

Post by ponector »

arandomusername wrote: post #691
motorest wrote: post #662

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm not sure what to think. Ukraine can't militarily defeat russia or reclaim its lost territory, (...) Are you sure about that? I mean, didn't Afghanistan forced Russia to retreat in defeat and leave the country? > and as long as it continues to try to do so, there will be war and the world will be less stable. All the more reason to help Ukraine finish the job and force Russia to leave. Ultimately, worst case sce…

> Are you sure about that? I mean, didn't Afghanistan forced Russia to retreat in defeat and leave the country? Logistics (Ukraine shares a large border with Russia) and people - the people in currently occupied Ukraine aren't as against Russia as those in Afghanistan may be. Even now, we don't really see much of sabotage. > All the more reason to help Ukraine finish the job and force Russia to leave. And how are you…

> Russia has more men This is true in general. But not true for soldiers. They have more so many men willing to fight in Ukraine. If they have so many men - why the are Korean soldiers fighting for Russia? Or Africans?

You simply echo Russia Today narratives.

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#775

Post by Aeolun »

xg15 wrote: post #392
aemu wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, man. I have emigrated from Russia to EU five years ago and it is heartbreaking to see the developed US and some European countries go through the same bullshit we were going since 2011. Like half the country starts living in wild, completely imaginary world, and you can always tell what is the current agenda of the propaganda machine just by talking to some relatives who fell through that rabbit hole

It's definitely been more than three weeks. As someone who lives in the EU and has the same kind of relatives, what I find frustrating is how little actual engagement with the Russian narratives there is from official sides. There is presented "evidence" for US influence in Ukraine long before the war, like the Victoria Nuland video, yet there seems to be no attempts at debunking those arguments, short of a catch-all…

> we at least have to engage with it and provide counterarguments

“Never argue with an idiot. They will drag you down to their level and beat you with experience.”

I swear to god, there is no talking with these people. It's like any argument you make slides right off their reality distortion field.

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#776

Post by justin66 »

dmitrygr wrote: post #651
xenospn wrote: post #70

[flagged]

I hear this a lot, but nobody can explain: why? What good are they to Russia? Ukraine is obvious to anyone who's studied history: as a buffer. What good are the Baltics to Russia, to justify the military expense of capturing them?

> I hear this a lot, but nobody can explain: why?

I'm sure that's untrue and it's been explained to you many times, but: because they're border states, just like Belarus and, yes, Ukraine. A "buffer" if you prefer.

The "Russian population" in Ukraine was enough to be used as a pretense for an attack by Putin, who believes a large Russian minority somehow makes the territory his. The ethnically Russian populations in Latvia and Estonia are, percentage-wise, larger than that of Ukraine.

Putin's an avowed fan of Alexandr Dugin, so you could look at his writings for some hints, but I'm not sure Putin draws the lines in precisely the same way. It helps to remember that Putin's also a psychopath.

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#777

Post by dlahoda »

skinnymuch wrote: post #675
dragonwriter wrote: post #507

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The current war started with the 2014 invasion by Russia . Claiming that the invasion of Ukraine by Russia is caused and justified by a thing which happened after and in response to that invasion is arguing for retrocausality. It is not "going back in history and cherry picking events" to point out when and how the current war started in a discussion of the causes of the current war , especially when an event that ha…

It started because of the western coup in Ukraine. Reminds me of people who say Oct 7 started the “war” in Palestine.

what do you mean by western coup?

so you would preffer russian troops killing political opponents and protesters in ua, like they did since 1992 in belarus till these day to avoid """coup"""?

or you prefer russian troops did 10x more massacre and hide it, instead they did 10x less in bucha and did not have time to hide?

btw just talk with pl and cz old people how their western coup was going.

seems like people prefer western coup to russian massacress and mass graves...

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#778

Post by ponector »

Aeolun wrote: post #770
arandomusername wrote: post #691

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Are you sure about that? I mean, didn't Afghanistan forced Russia to retreat in defeat and leave the country? Logistics (Ukraine shares a large border with Russia) and people - the people in currently occupied Ukraine aren't as against Russia as those in Afghanistan may be. Even now, we don't really see much of sabotage. > All the more reason to help Ukraine finish the job and force Russia to leave. And how are you…

Collective defense was always an option. It's not like anyone has the appetite for that, but it's not hard as such to kick Russia out of Ukraine.

It's not that hard and even no troops required. Send more weapons without restrictions to use them against Russians, tight real sanctions and they will be defeated

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#779

Post by Aeolun »

jopsen wrote: post #540
generic92034 wrote: post #455

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Countering pushed narratives with facts and arguments is a complete failure. It does not reach the emotional core, which is "us versus them".

Wasn't that what we the west did during the cold war? Is it not just that media is more fragmented and we've underfunded the fact providing media since?

Maybe it's more that the media companies have been bought up by oligarchs that think the narrative that's being pushed is just fine and dandy?

Re: U.S. pauses all military aid to Ukraine

#780

Post by codedokode »

GJim wrote: post #479
lfmunoz4 wrote: post #435

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you remember what happened when Russia tried to install missiles in Cuba? The USA put its foot down and was willing to have a nuclear war. Same thing is happening in Russia, making Ukraine part of NATO is just too close. Why is it so hard for people to understand this?

Except NATO is a defence organisation. Ask yourself why countries bordering Russia want to join.

Well missiles on Cuba might also be intended for defense. As USSR leader wrote in a letter to US president, "you know that one cannot invade the country with missiles" or something along these lines.
Post reply on HN