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Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

bbc.com

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Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#771

Post by freedomben »

seanmcdirmid wrote: post #671
flkiwi wrote: post #309

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My bio father (he was not a part of my life, which is important to note when you get to the end of this comment) lived to 89, for certain values of "lived". He had long ago exhausted his ability to support himself financially, he was blind, deaf, unable to get around town on his own, had substantial age-related mental health issues, as well as a litany of small but significant health issues. I cannot speak for him, b…

My mom died on her own terms in the states at 57 and her doctor gave her the pills to do it at home. It wasn’t as nice as dying in the hospital, but her life quality had been pretty bad for the last decade and doctors will help even in my state where assisted suicide isn’t legal (Washington state rather than Oregon).

How long ago was this? Ever since war on opioids started, doctors have been extremely closely scrutinized by the DEA. Actually helping and even treating patients in some cases is a good way to risk losing your license and livelihood, and possibly your freedom. (and the War on Opioids didn't just apply to opioids, it caused a massive pendulum swing that affects all "controlled substances" not just pain pills, hence why it would be relevant here)

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#773

Post by bscphil »

8note wrote: post #542
bscphil wrote: post #442

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The user you're responding to is very clearly presenting a hypothetical argument, not something that actually exists. The GP asked "Who decides on the duration of the waiting period? Why can’t people be in charge of their own lives?" And the OP is making that point that (a) there must be someone in a position to make that decision, and that (b) there must be some waiting period. In fact, if as you imply there are no…

i dont think id characterize those as limits on individual freedom, as much as a requirement of individual freedom. you actually have to want it, vs a whim where you might be drunk and not make the choice you wanted

Yes, it's true that for the choice to be a free one you have to actually want it, but making another person the arbiter of that reduces freedom insofar as there will be people who do freely want it and are forced to wait, or who freely want it and are rejected due to being able to prove they want to to the arbiter's satisfaction.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#774

Post by buttercraft »

nashashmi wrote: post #320
jncfhnb wrote: post #299

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What do you need from grandma, who is in constant pain and desires to die?

The touch, the voice, the eyes of love, the concern, the stories, the heart, the smile, ... shall I go on?

So you want grandma to suffer for you. How very selfish.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#775

Post by Neonlicht »

wryoak wrote: post #353
Yeul wrote: post #329

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

That’s not what life is about in Christianity at all. Life is about choice in Christianity. Freedom. You can choose to live for yourself or for others, for the world. Dwelling on one’s suffering is a form of egoism that distances one from others and thus God. That’s why suicide is a sin in Christian theology, because it arises from individualism, which denies the Holy Spirit that comprises and composes us all. Asking…

Universal healthcare would be a Christian duty then? How's that working out?

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#776

Post by seanmcdirmid »

freedomben wrote: post #771
seanmcdirmid wrote: post #671

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My mom died on her own terms in the states at 57 and her doctor gave her the pills to do it at home. It wasn’t as nice as dying in the hospital, but her life quality had been pretty bad for the last decade and doctors will help even in my state where assisted suicide isn’t legal (Washington state rather than Oregon).

How long ago was this? Ever since war on opioids started, doctors have been extremely closely scrutinized by the DEA. Actually helping and even treating patients in some cases is a good way to risk losing your license and livelihood, and possibly your freedom. (and the War on Opioids didn't just apply to opioids, it caused a massive pendulum swing that affects all "controlled substances" not just pain pills, hence wh…

2009, so 15 years ago?

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#777

Post by dns_snek »

tpoacher wrote: post #82

People have made arguments against abuse in vulnerable populations, which I think is an important argument. But one thing that I really haven't seen explored, and specifically where this applies to suicidal ideation, is the extent to which this is considered a 'condition' or not. The human body / brain has extremely powerful mechanisms for ensuring certain 'drives' that are essential for the survival and propagation…

> So the fact that when it comes to suicidal ideation we are less prone to say "this is a disease which circumvents the brain's normal processes that create the imperative urge to survive, leaving one suicidal", and we just go "wouldn't it be nice if they could end their life peacefully without consequences" is bizzare.

Those aren't conflicting beliefs. I think everyone would agree that suicidal ideation is a result of some form of abnormal state of mind, it doesn't need to be restated, but the fact is that we don't have cures. What if they've already received psychiatric care and they're still suicidal?

I agree that we should provide people with the best care that we can in order to treat the root cause but ultimately it's up to them to decide what they want to do with their own life, whether it be treatment or ending it in a humane way.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#778

Post by HeatrayEnjoyer »

Neonlicht wrote: post #769
wucaworld wrote: post #741

Earlier quoted context omitted.

B.s. parent literally gave an example of someone that got access to MAID a week after their doc visit. I’ve changed my mind on things after a month. Not saying MAID is bad or should be banned. I’m saying people will 100 percent abuse the system. My concern is healthcare system practiioners. I am dealing with a ton of people whose job it is to press our family into a decision we don’t want to make. This includes an md…

But it is. Most people are not rich to pay for their own care. Society doesn't want tax increases. We don't have enough healthcare workers. Reality doesn't care about how things should be.

Society != a small but influential wealthy minority

Framing it as unchangeable "reality" is intellectually dishonest.

Re: Assisted dying now accounts for one in 20 Canada deaths

#780

Post by rawgabbit »

Spivak wrote: post #684
s1artibartfast wrote: post #535

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think there is a ton of wiggle room in the words prolong, burdensome, or discomfort

Not as much as you'd think. Catholicism is very much has what is essentially statutory law and common law, and common law removes many of the ambiguities. It's the Protestants who are like "we all have the same book let's talk about how we interpret it" while Catholics have a canon interpretation over which much blood has been spilled to arrive at. Here's the link to the OG https://www.vatican.va/roman_curia/congrega…

From the url: When inevitable death is imminent in spite of the means used, it is permitted in conscience to take the decision to refuse forms of treatment that would only secure a precarious and burdensome prolongation of life, so long as the normal care due to the sick person in similar cases is not interrupted. In such circumstances the doctor has no reason to reproach himself with failing to help the person in danger.
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