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I wish GPT4 had never happened

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Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#771

Post by smikhanov »

cambaceres wrote: post #749
HyperSane wrote: post #450

The fact that so many people fear loss of income as a result of better AI is a real indictment of our economic system. A better system that more fairly distributed economic productivity would make people welcome better AI because they could be confident it would make everyone wealthier instead of just a few people rich enough to be Goa'uld.

I don’t know what country you live in, but I can tell you how it is in Sweden. As a freelancer I pay appropriately 70% of what I charge in taxes. How high do you think taxes can get before people stop putting energy into raising their productivity?

Nobody can be fully certain of this, but I suspect all the way up to 100%

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#772

Post by zamnos »

simonh wrote: post #756
HyperSane wrote: post #450

The fact that so many people fear loss of income as a result of better AI is a real indictment of our economic system. A better system that more fairly distributed economic productivity would make people welcome better AI because they could be confident it would make everyone wealthier instead of just a few people rich enough to be Goa'uld.

The fact that anyone today thinks that any other economic system we’ve ever tried is any better than the one we have is a damning indictment of our education system.

The fact that USA's brand of late-stage capitalism is even considered capitalism is an even more damning indictment of our education system.

Somewhere between Feudalism and Karl Marx, Adam Smith is spinning in his grave. How much we don't have capitalism and are living, globally, under an oligopoly, replete with robber barons in tech clothes; one can only laugh at.

The amount of misery under "capitalism" says there's got to be a better way.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#773

Post by TexanFeller »

HyperSane wrote: post #718
mertd wrote: post #655

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People are very good at creating work. Every time tech creates a paradigm shift and people cry that there will be not enough work, the exact opposite happens.

In the US at least we have used every technology that increases productivity to keep hours of labor constant and make the rich richer. Millions of Wal-Mart workers have to do a year of hard labor just to earn the cost of a set of new tires for the CEO's 10th supercar.

> Millions of Wal-Mart workers have to do a year of hard labor

Working at Wal-Mart would be miserable in many ways, however nothing I've ever seen their employees do is even 10% of what I'd call "hard labor". Probably even their warehouses are not even close to farm/ranch/factory labor people associate with that term.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#774

Post by surgical_fire »

halfjoking wrote: post #678
throw__away7391 wrote: post #457

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Shell scripting and JavaScript are strengths, any kind of server-side language like Scala or C# it really falls apart quite quickly. I think that integrating into existing APIs is the Achilles' heel, GPT-4 doesn't seem to do any better here either. It makes me wonder if someday we might not get better results completely eschewing libraries altogether and letting the transformers generate literally everything--perhaps…

I’ve also been wondering if no framework coding will be more productive for LLM driven software. How many times have frameworks like React changed since it was created? A changing framework means the LLM may mix training from multiple versions and create errors. Whereas libraries that don’t change can produce consistent results. So use stable libraries that choose backwards compatibility at any cost, over the ones th…

Frameworks and high-level languages exist as abstractions to make writing code easier for humans.

Wouldn't make more sense for a machine to just write assembly directly?

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#775

Post by buu700 »

ilyt wrote: post #712
buu700 wrote: post #669

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's an idea: a UBI that's pegged to GDP and population. Make it comically small to start, like say 0.25% of GDP split evenly between all citizens. Based on 2021 US stats, that's $176 per person per year. That seems relatively unobjectionable regardless of your politics, even assuming that the % is likely to drift higher over time. With increasingly advanced AI and cheap energy, GDP would rise over the long run ind…

Here is even simpler idea to make that feasible: Start actually taxing the corporations in a way that can't be trivially avoided. And don't tax them less than your own citizens. Maybe tax a bit of income on top of revenue. Maybe tax a bit more if income per employee is on high side.

If you're talking about a five-figure UBI, I don't think that would be simpler to pass through Congress.

In terms of legislative complexity, I can't see how closing all major corporate tax loopholes would be simpler than implementing whatever minor tax revenue increase is necessary to offset a $176 UBI.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#776

Post by BirdieNZ »

ilaksh wrote: post #730
qaq wrote: post #629

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well maybe shift to "real world" professions will occur resulting in us addressing abysmal infrastructure and housing situation. I am looking at picking up a trade because of this coming shift.

Robotics will rapidly pick up improved capabilities. With so many people out of work and so much automation being consolidated, what do you think all the entrepreneurs and researchers will look to next? It will be breakthroughs and efficiency improvements in robotics . I think this "learn a trade" plan has maybe 5 years max. By then the trades will also be automated.

I'm not a gambling man but if I was I would put a very large amount of my net worth on a bet that no trades will be automated in 5 years time. Not a single one.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#777

Post by vages »

__pache__ wrote: post #755
cambaceres wrote: post #749

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know what country you live in, but I can tell you how it is in Sweden. As a freelancer I pay appropriately 70% of what I charge in taxes. How high do you think taxes can get before people stop putting energy into raising their productivity?

[flagged]

The Nordic countries are actually the easiest place in the world to earn at least 30 million dollars (or become billionaire for that case) exactly because of the welfare system: https://youtu.be/A9UmdY0E8hU

When you don’t have to struggle for a living, you’re more free to take risks and start your own business. Workers accept disruptive innovation and being let go, knowing that the state will help them reskill if necessary.

Edit: Changed sentence from "earn a million dollars" to "30 million dollars" to reflect the actual video contents. (Mea culpa.)

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#778

Post by emrah »

> What a dumb thing to say, right? Technological progress is always good.

It's not that it's always good, bad or anything else. It is simply inevitable.

Technology is not a living thing and it has no will. We are andromorphizing the collective behavior of lots of people. It's the people with curiosity, drive, ambition to achieve something, like build a tool that can think and perform like a brain.

So progress is inevitable because people push it forward to satisfy their own internal drives. Changing this requires changing people's drives. Given the current dominant economic model, that's close to impossible because this is exactly what it is prioritizing, contribution and progress at any cost to anyone.

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#779

Post by lazide »

Aaargh20318 wrote: post #45
atemerev wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

[flagged]

Because the only two options are capitalism and communism ? Communism doesn't work so just let's give up, not try anything else and let the rich exploit the majority of the human race.

What, concretely, do you propose then?

Re: I wish GPT4 had never happened

#780

Post by cambaceres »

smikhanov wrote: post #771
cambaceres wrote: post #749

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know what country you live in, but I can tell you how it is in Sweden. As a freelancer I pay appropriately 70% of what I charge in taxes. How high do you think taxes can get before people stop putting energy into raising their productivity?

Nobody can be fully certain of this, but I suspect all the way up to 100%

We can actually be certain that humans work the other way since we ran huge experiments in labs called the Soviet Union and China. In those experiments we found out that people worked way less/not at all when there was no economic incentive to do so.
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