Live data from Hacker News

Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

latimes.com

761–770 of 925 posts

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#761

Its bad for natives and African Americans. The whole system is designed to keep them poor and powerless

progressive with a throwaway account: "We can't expect BIPOC people to pass SATs, because of reasons". The reason is racism. The evidence shows the opposite, SAT testing allows hardworking/gifted minorities to get ahead.

[flagged]

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#762

"In 11th grade, the most relevant grade relating to college readiness, 30.5% of students met or exceeded math learning standards. Of these, nearly half exceeded the learning standard — marking them as likely to be the best prepared for a college STEM major." You can see this 30.5% in the 'grade 11' chart on this page: https://tools.encona.com/caaspp-explorer#slots=state&s=math Politicians in California want the ethni…

> Politicians in California want the ethnic mix of students at public universities to reflect the ethnic mix of the state population. They cannot achieve this goal if colleges use academic preparedness as the main factor in admissions

That's a satisfiable goal, but it means they have to accept that they need extremely broad and deep remedial courses, and they need to treat admissions more or less like a community college does. Is that what they're looking to do? What are their goals regarding the existing community college system?

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#763

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Crazy that such a load bearing job isn't better funded and more respected. Arguably the most important job in society and the level of respect, pay and to some extent training (at least a lot of places require a masters for what that's worth) is absolutely not commensurate with it's importance. I dropped out of high school for the same reason, I had a teacher that failed me for writing an essay in three different sty…

education is highly funded. teachers are not paid well because there is a perception that "anyone can be a teacher" (which is true in the sense that there is no particular enumerable qualification or credential that makes you a good teacher) so the market is full of people who decide that they should be a teacher (many should not, but there is no a priori way of knowing). supply high. a lot of education funding goes…

[flagged]

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#764

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Having just shipped the kiddo into the real world, she's leaning liberal arts (her and her mom suck at math), but she has a benefit neither her mom or I had - EU deal citizenship. She's going to do a year here to figure things out - she's also been thinking about Europe. University in Europe, for undergrad, is different than the US. I think the large class model and a barrier of exams to advance makes sense in Europe…

Does EU dual citizenship help with university if you are not currently a resident of the EU? I always thought the low EU-local fees for European universities were based on EU residency, not citizenship.

In most of Germany neither is required (Baden Württemberg requires non-EU citizens to pay 1.5k€ per semester). Commonly though you have to pay from 200 to 300€ administrative fees.

The harder problem is to enter Germany, but as you have EU citizenship, that's not a problem for you.

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#765

I can’t help comparing this to the system I grew up in (Italy), which is vastly different and it seemingly produces very good graduates. University was free and there was no test for enrolling in STEM degrees, and you could retry exams every semester as much as you wanted to. But goddamit exams were HARD and if you weren’t prepared enough you would keep failing until you gave up. We weren’t entitled because we weren’…

What about the demands on the time of professors from students who repeatedly try and fail the exams? Seems like that could get expensive for taxpayers. Maybe it doesn’t happen much in practice?

It did happen quite often to have to retake a few exams. Some students could never clear some particularly hard ones. But I have never heard any professor ever complain about it. Nobody wants a struggling student to finally succeed more than the professor who has to keep failing them.

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#766

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Your claim is "a strong genetic correlation". You can look up what that means mathematically.

[flagged]

I'm really not all that interested in whatever this is. You made an objective claim about the science that is false. That's all I care about.

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#767
post #179

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've got to be kidding. Writing longhand was always a miserable experience for me no matter what technique or pen I used. Typing on a keyboard is so much faster and more fluent.

Same. Slowly writing things out by hand is excruciating for me. I would always refuse to do it, even as a kid. Rarely took notes.

I almost wish I could go back to school so I could use Goodnotes or Notability with my iPad to take notes awesome.

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#768

I can’t help comparing this to the system I grew up in (Italy), which is vastly different and it seemingly produces very good graduates. University was free and there was no test for enrolling in STEM degrees, and you could retry exams every semester as much as you wanted to. But goddamit exams were HARD and if you weren’t prepared enough you would keep failing until you gave up. We weren’t entitled because we weren’…

What about the demands on the time of professors from students who repeatedly try and fail the exams? Seems like that could get expensive for taxpayers. Maybe it doesn’t happen much in practice?

Probably less expensive than paying for an imperial war machine if I had to guess.

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#769

I can’t help comparing this to the system I grew up in (Italy), which is vastly different and it seemingly produces very good graduates. University was free and there was no test for enrolling in STEM degrees, and you could retry exams every semester as much as you wanted to. But goddamit exams were HARD and if you weren’t prepared enough you would keep failing until you gave up. We weren’t entitled because we weren’…

What about the demands on the time of professors from students who repeatedly try and fail the exams? Seems like that could get expensive for taxpayers. Maybe it doesn’t happen much in practice?

I can't imagine marking the exams was a significant part of the professors time. Especially because its probably the sort of thing they could get an assistant to do.

Re: Citing 'severe' math deficits, UC faculty demand a return to SAT tests for STEM

#770
post #163

Earlier quoted context omitted.

blackboards in uni where you can't do anything but just rewrite everything the prof is writing is a nightmarish waste of time, especially for anyone with any kind of attention difficulties please remove the devices from the students but provide slides

If you have attention difficulties perhaps uni isn't the place for you.

This is awful advice… Academia, specifically STEM, is already oversaturated with people on the opposite side of the spectrum from “attention difficulties” but are otherwise only above-average people intellectually. They were able to follow the beaten path to the letter all their lives, but are not really capable of making meaningful contributions to their field. We should be filtering these people out more not less.
Post reply on HN