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AI slop is killing online communities

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Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#761

Post by dspillett »

matheusmoreira wrote: post #757
dspillett wrote: post #756

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Their rules said duplicates should be deleted, at least most of the time, so they were. While it might be nice for extra useful content from the dup to be merged into the original page, that would be a lot of work and much of the time there isn't enough to make it worthwhile (or any). > for literally no reason Other than the reason that it was their site and that is what they chose to do. While some criticism of SO i…

> Other than the reason that it was their site and that is what they chose to do. Welp, they can go to hell along with their site. AI is better than stack exchange anyways. Everybody's got boundaries, and they managed to cross mine. I can deal with rudeness and toxicity just fine. I can deal with moderators enforcing the rules. Straight up deleting stuff is simply not acceptable though, and I couldn't care less how t…

You might be happier in life if, having decided that you didn't like how things were done there, you moved on and got on with things elsewhere, rather than moving on but still being bitter and complainy about it to this very day.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#762

Post by protocolture »

iNerdier wrote: post #571
protocolture wrote: post #557

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>Their opinion about AI or blockchain most likely has absolutely nothing to do with you. Which is why I left before I was banned. I no longer felt comfortable and they probably likewise. They wanted a safe space to hate on people involved in AI art and my leaving contributed to that. That said, I doubt I could have posted content calling for the death of authors or honestly any other group in that space without being…

You didn’t like the broader consensus views towards llm usage but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t ultimately a positive to their community that you left. It sounds as though there was a mismatch in what you and the broader group wanted so perhaps a non-confrontational split is the best that could be hoped for in this situation?

>You didn’t like the broader consensus views towards llm usage but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t ultimately a positive to their community that you left. It sounds as though there was a mismatch in what you and the broader group wanted so perhaps a non-confrontational split is the best that could be hoped for in this situation?

I didnt enjoy that sentiment shifted so rapidly that people were openly discussing murder without pushback. I had a hard time reconciling being there as an open LLM user while they were doing their 5 minutes of hate or whatever.

I am in another space where there's a lot of discussion about AI, and I sit generally between the haters, the people that dont care, and the guy who thinks that its literally unstoppable and everything is going to be amazing etc. I argue politely with all of them.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#763

Post by protocolture »

lelanthran wrote: post #604
protocolture wrote: post #366

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>shrug off around 600 AI content creator accounts monthly. >I fear losing the battle. I was in a small niche creative writing community for a while. Circa 2021\22. AI wasn't why I was there but I demo'd a few LLMs to a lot of the users in the Off Topic section because people were curious. Even with an explanation of how they operated, almost everyone was at least interested. One author told me how he operated similar…

> I just don't think its possible to maintain such artificial rage for more than a few years. What makes you think the rage is artificial?

What makes you think the rage is sustainable?

My first clue is my memory of blockchain as I mentioned.

My biggest clue however is that it appears to be a London Horse Manure sort of problem. People stopped hating horses when London didnt end up covered under 20M of Horse Manure.

I know there are multiple angles to AI, and people ardently against AI tend to have multiple sets of goal posts prepositioned for switching, but ultimately they tend to come back to the ecological/electrical issues. Those issues are based on projections that rely on speculation that relies on OpenAI/Anthropic/Azure/Amazon plans being fulfilled perfectly + a continuation in that mode. We are already seeing these plans fall over and investment going elsewhere. It will be difficult to maintain the narrative that AI Compute is a direct risk to the environment as the projects dry up.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#764

Post by matheusmoreira »

dspillett wrote: post #761
matheusmoreira wrote: post #757

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Other than the reason that it was their site and that is what they chose to do. Welp, they can go to hell along with their site. AI is better than stack exchange anyways. Everybody's got boundaries, and they managed to cross mine. I can deal with rudeness and toxicity just fine. I can deal with moderators enforcing the rules. Straight up deleting stuff is simply not acceptable though, and I couldn't care less how t…

You might be happier in life if, having decided that you didn't like how things were done there, you moved on and got on with things elsewhere, rather than moving on but still being bitter and complainy about it to this very day.

It's not bitterness, it's anger. It can be a rather enjoyable and cathartic emotion, especially when one is confronting perceived wrongs.

Another benefit of sharing experiences, especially negative ones: it can help others. Maybe there are people on this site who aren't yet aware that stack exchange embraced deletionism. I certainly wasn't, wouldn't have contributed otherwise. If I help even one person realize this, it was worth it. That realization could prevent them from having their work closed down and deleted before they had even finished writing it.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#765

Post by lelanthran »

protocolture wrote: post #763
lelanthran wrote: post #604

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I just don't think its possible to maintain such artificial rage for more than a few years. What makes you think the rage is artificial?

What makes you think the rage is sustainable? My first clue is my memory of blockchain as I mentioned. My biggest clue however is that it appears to be a London Horse Manure sort of problem. People stopped hating horses when London didnt end up covered under 20M of Horse Manure. I know there are multiple angles to AI, and people ardently against AI tend to have multiple sets of goal posts prepositioned for switching,…

> What makes you think the rage is sustainable?

Where did I imply that the rage is sustainable? I asked why you consider it "artificial", cos it looks damn real to me.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#766

Post by 21asdffdsa12 »

spoiler wrote: post #632
21asdffdsa12 wrote: post #628

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eagerness.. you let them work through a endless labyrinth of forms. While the human drops out after the 2nd form- the ai is willing to go all the way always.

Don't you lose really users by making it easy for bots to complete a sign up, but hard for humans?

You could also pretend to pass-through and watch the behavior of the "user" after success.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#767

Post by a96 »

rgblambda wrote: post #610
goodmythical wrote: post #524

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, because I cannot possibly purchase a thousand such letters for less than the cost of minimum wage for an hour or two.

Where I live a 2nd class stamp costs the equivalent of $1.24. That's $1240 for a thousand. Not including the cost of the letter itself, or the envelope, or the cost to write it if it's being farmed out to overseas labour, who then has to send it by international postage. And then you have evidence of where the letter originated, and that can be compared with how the user presents themselves online. Little bit more th…

The kind of place that will make and send letters by the thousand will probably have a better deal on postage.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#768

Post by a96 »

thinkingtoilet wrote: post #153
CrzyLngPwd wrote: post #55

I run a niche creative community, and we outlawed AI-generated content in 2022 as it was easy to see how corrosive it would be to the community. It hasn't been easy. We ban fake AI accounts daily and shrug off around 600 AI content creator accounts monthly. It's a lot of work, extra work that wasn't needed before AI content came around, and of course, that is an extra cost. I fear losing the battle.

What about charging $1 or $5 for an account? Seems like you could stem the tide pretty easily with something like that.

There is still no good way to send or receive such payments that works globally. Let alone one that doesn't mean leaking personal information. This will deter a lot of good users, but not many bad actors, as others have pointed out.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#769

Post by AdminAccount »

poly2it wrote: post #644
AdminAccount wrote: post #574

I think the only reason stackoverflow still has any activity is because the community choose to ban AI content [1] and so did most of its other networks [2]. Perhaps it will even see a (small) resurgence when AI providers start charging for the actual costs. [1] https://meta.stackoverflow.com/questions/421831 [2] https://meta.stackexchange.com/questions/384922

I keep hearing that AI providers will eventually stop "subsidising inference", but I do not understand how this would make any sense economically. It is already profitable to host AI model inference for prices cheaper than the big labs are charging, as evident by the plethora of providers available to choose from on OpenRouter, for example. The only way prices could rise without competition is if you sidestepped supp…

The hosting in it of itself is relatively cheap however with the current attempt by pretty much every major player to outpace one another means they are heavily investing in R&D/ model training, related infrastructure expansion, personnel recruitment/poaching etc. This all makes (to my knowledge all) major model provider run at a net loss despite the huge revenue some have.

Re: AI slop is killing online communities

#770

Post by a96 »

20k wrote: post #272
vohk wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it's going to effectively kill public chat communities without either proof of identity or attestation through a web of trust. Or rather turn them into little better than comment sections on news sites; thriving but worthless. I'm active in a number of online communities that are doing just fine but the difference is those all involve ongoing relationships, built over time and with engagement across multiple…

Personally I think we need to start utilising the safety features built into AI, to ensure that who we're talking to is a human. We'll start to have to only reply to people who talk in nsfw cursewords (like cocks), or profess their love of capybaras

A shell script will thwart that, but it will drive away a lot of civilized people.
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