There's something off about LED bulbs • Hacker News Board

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#761

Post by chongli » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:01 PM UTC

jghn wrote: post #739

vl wrote: post #611

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You can't buy a bulb that is rated to last a lifetime, but you can buy ones rated to last for 10+ years if used 8 hours a day (i.e. 35,000 life hours). I retrofitted entire house - 200+ bulbs and fixture retrofits more that 5 years ago. I had one or failures since. I bought highest CRI bulbs, i.e. most expensive, and they work well. (Also, do not use bulbs for downlights - get entire "led can light fixture retrofit")…

> 35,000 life hours How trustworthy is that state though? I have always assumed 0% trustworthy. Is that incorrect?

If you don’t trust the manufacturers, you’ll have to find an expert to trust, or tear down the bulbs and examine them yourself. The best way to know for sure is to measure the current being driven through the LEDs and compare it to their maximum rated current. The ones that don’t last long are usually being run at their maximum current, producing a lot of excess heat which shortens their lives dramatically.

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#762

Post by jasonlaramburu » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:01 PM UTC

bagels wrote: post #756

jasonlaramburu wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It is possible (and not very difficult) to design LED bulbs that will practically outlive their owners It is also possible (and not very difficult) to design incandescent bulbs that will outlive their owners. In fact, the first mass produced light bulbs generally lasted 2,500+ hours. In the 1920s, the major bulb manufacturers formed the 'Pheobus Cartel' in Geneva and secretly colluded to limit the lifespan of bulbs…

2500 hours is 100 days. I hope I live longer than 100 more days :(

Please consider reading the linked article. The longest continuously active incandescent bulb in the world was switched on in 1901.

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#763

Post by jasonlaramburu » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:02 PM UTC

CydeWeys wrote: post #705

jasonlaramburu wrote: post #502

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>It is possible (and not very difficult) to design LED bulbs that will practically outlive their owners It is also possible (and not very difficult) to design incandescent bulbs that will outlive their owners. In fact, the first mass produced light bulbs generally lasted 2,500+ hours. In the 1920s, the major bulb manufacturers formed the 'Pheobus Cartel' in Geneva and secretly colluded to limit the lifespan of bulbs…

Ah yes, people, famous for living less than checks notes 2,500 hours.

Please consider reading the linked article first. The longest continuously active incandescent bulb in the world was switched on in 1901.

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#764

Post by gravesisme » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:03 PM UTC

I have gradually replaced every light bulb in my house since 2017 with Philips Hue bulbs (most color, but some white only) and not one of them has flickered, become more dim, or failed. On the other hand, the "cheap $10" LED bulbs that I originally installed when first moving in - because I could not afford $50 a bulb - have all died and were part of my motivation for upgrading to Hue. This has also happened with the cheaper LED bulbs that my mother and in-laws installed, which lasted about a year. I wonder why the Hue bulbs last so much longer? They have been well worth the money and have become a staple of my home automation.

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#765

Post by mixmastamyk » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:03 PM UTC

ikekkdcjkfke wrote: post #586

jsmith45 wrote: post #516

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I really wish i could find a brand that would reliably tick all the boxes: - Does not overdrive the LEDs and Does not run power supply components at the limit of what they can. (Thus good longevity) - Has a current based driver, so that slight voltage shifts from an appliance kicking on don't result in an obvious brightness shift. - Suitable for use in recessed lighting or enclosed fixtures. (For better or worse, can…

I think ikea has some nice bulbs. Almost no flicker on slo mo camera. Their rechargeable batteries however are bad

Their bulbs and batteries work great here.

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#766

Post by dang » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:04 PM UTC

tomatotomato37 wrote: post #150

I hate how many of these things aren't limits of the technology but rather the result of cost optimization and general apathy towards the customer. We know how to mass-produce quality LEDs to the point entire TVs are made of the things. We know how to mass-produce rectifiers pretty much ever since diodes existed. We know how to cool mass-produced objects in compact spaces. But because we apparently can't have nice th…

We detached this subthread from https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=35372444 - it's fine, but I'm trying to prune things so the thread isn't so top heavy.

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#767

Post by sydd » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:07 PM UTC

llbeansandrice wrote: post #424

jchw wrote: post #305

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some bulbs will give you information on their CRI which ideally should be required to be labeled on the bulbs packaging the way calorie information is required on food packaging (but I don't think it is.) That will tell you roughly how good the quality of the light is by proxy of the spectrum of light it covers. On the other hand, there is no equivalent afaik for knowing how well the power supply is designed or how h…

Can't wait to become a mini-expert in fucking LED lightbulbs just to have decent lighting in my house. I hate that the vast information of the internet has basically required us mere mortals to try and become experts in literally anything and everything just to be able to buy something that isn't awful. Computer? Better keep up to date on all of the CPU, GPU, etc. info. That doesn't even include the insanity of monit…

I'm in the same boat. For the sake of simplicity find some good brands and stick to them. Where I live its simple, get all your bulbs at IKEA. Most of them are 90 CRI and other parameters are good too. There are better ones on the market, but I dont want to go on a product hunt if my supplier is out

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#768

Post by jacobp100 » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:08 PM UTC

Just some notes on LEDs for anyone having problems with dimmer switches:-

- Make sure your dimmer switch is compatible with LEDs - ideally only compatible with LEDs, as sometimes the ones that also handle halogen bulbs can buzz

- Make sure your bulbs are dimmable

- The LED and dimmer switch need to either both be leading edge, or both be trailing edge (but almost all are trailing edge now)

- If your bulbs are too dim, read the manual for your dimmer switch - there will be a series of pushes and twists to configure it and/or manufacture reset

- Lights starting up slower than a normal on/off switch is normal - it's the bulb and dimmer "negotiating", and it makes them both last longer

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#769

Post by amluto » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:10 PM UTC

dredmorbius wrote: post #757

Joker_vD wrote: post #558

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Trying to cram all the infrastructure for an LED lamp into the shape of a light bulb is a bad idea, even if the input power is DC. Absolutely, the incandescent light bulbs have that shape for a reason: the screw is small because there is nothing to put in it and it doesn't heat, the bulb is large to dissipate all the light and heat it generates. And the LED light bulbs have exactly opposite problems: almost all of…

There are finned LED bulbs which can fit standard Edison Screw sockets, e.g.: https://www.designboom.com/technology/self-cooling-100-watt-... > https://i.pinimg.com/originals/b5/c2/c5/b5c2c5d69fb240a571ba... > It's also helpful to recognise that existing lighting fixtures and lamps were designed around the constraints of incandescent bulbs. The first generation of LED bulbs and lamps largely conform to these. As LEDs…

I sure hope 12V doesn’t happen. 12V is absurdly low for lighting and needs extremely thick wires to get decent efficiency.

24V is okay. 48V would be nicer for indoor use.

Re: There's something off about LED bulbs

#770

Post by amluto » Thu, Mar 30, 2023, 9:14 PM UTC

jacobp100 wrote: post #768

Just some notes on LEDs for anyone having problems with dimmer switches:- - Make sure your dimmer switch is compatible with LEDs - ideally only compatible with LEDs, as sometimes the ones that also handle halogen bulbs can buzz - Make sure your bulbs are dimmable - The LED and dimmer switch need to either both be leading edge, or both be trailing edge (but almost all are trailing edge now) - If your bulbs are too dim…

> Lights starting up slower than a normal on/off switch is normal - it's the bulb and dimmer "negotiating", and it makes them both last longer

Negotiating? Some dimmers might “adapt” and choose which style to be (leading or trailing edge), but most don’t. I think the real issue is the startup time of the power supply, especially when starting dimmed and therefore getting a horrible waveform.