761–770 of 864 posts
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I had a similar recall with my washing machine. It was literally updated automatically before I even knew a recall existed.
Why the hell does your washing machine need internet access?
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No, I didn't mean that at all. All Teslas come with Autopilot. It's adaptive cruise control and automatic steering that will keep you in your lane. It's awesome, and I love it. "Enhanced" autopilot, which currently is $6000 extra, is automatic lane change, automatically taking exits, summon, and automatic parking. The automatic lane change is nice, but it fails too often to be worth thousands of dollars. All the rest…
Prices and packages aside, I'm asking can you turn on basic cruise control without turning on any form of automatic steering? To me, design hubris is forcing someone to accept a choice-limiting or poorly documented form of automation in order to accept a more basic form. I have a Fiat 124 Spider... love it, but it has one "feature" that I absolutely hate, which is that if you hold the clutch down and brake while stop…
Yes.
BTW, the automatic steering is very easy to override by just turning the wheel. When I change lanes I just turn the wheel and then turn autopilot back on.
BTW, I also had a Subaru that held the clutch on a hill. I really appreciated it in San Francisco. Personally, I don't understand the hate. I never felt like I needed it, but I remember my mom complaining about other people rolling back in a steep driveway at my preschool in the 1980s. Maybe the feature is needed for those places in the world where everyone drives stick, even the people who are clutzes?
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> Also, public transit would do the same. Does public transit pick me up at my front door and drop me off at any location I choose? Does public transit take of the minute I leave the house? Is public transit available 24/7, even in remote areas? Does public transit wait for me to load 2 kids, a dog, 4 suit cases, and various bags, blankets, and toys? Does public transit turn around after 2 minutes, bring me back, and…
Does a Tesla travel at 125mph from my town to central London? No? Well, then you can hardly claim that a self-driving car oh for goodness’ sake why am I even attempting to argue with motorheads on HN.
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> Also, public transit would do the same. Does public transit pick me up at my front door and drop me off at any location I choose? Does public transit take of the minute I leave the house? Is public transit available 24/7, even in remote areas? Does public transit wait for me to load 2 kids, a dog, 4 suit cases, and various bags, blankets, and toys? Does public transit turn around after 2 minutes, bring me back, and…
Then by all means lets let the self driving cars have free roam then. Current state of technology and failures be damned
That's not what I'm saying at all. Please read again.
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Why? It involves a safety system! That needs to be tracked publicly and updated! Nothing more than an OTA - does not mean much when everything is fly by wire and a bug could mean your car does not stop accelerating or something.
Recall implies something being returned. This should be called a mandatory software patch, or something like that. The problem is Tesla owners repeatedly see "recall" to mean "software update", so this might lead to a lot of confusion if a physical recall is actually required in the future.
That's where the word came from, that's true. But a legal framework has built up around the concept over the decades which isn't dependent on you having to drive the car to the dealer, all of which still applies, so the word is still used.
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The calculation is easy, FSD does the wrong thing so often that there's no question a human driver is safer.
The question is not if FSD makes mistakes, its if FSD+a human driver monitoring is worse then a human driver.
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> Recalling the hardware is a drastically more difficult request to impose on customers and financially/logistically for the car maker. And the distinction matters to consumers because...? A component is faulty. It needs to be fixed. Whether or not you have to drive to a dealership, if it's OTA, if someone at a dealership needs to plug a specialized device to your car's OBD port, or the car is unfixable and needs to…
I would say that whether a "recall" requires some action on the part of the owner is a very important distinguishing factor. A recall should unambiguously mean that some action from the owner is required to resolve the issue (e.g. taking it to a dealer to get a software update installed.) If no action is required (other than caution / not using the product feature), we should use some other term such as "safety advis…
Should, perhaps. But recall has a meaning with legal implications, so it matters. A recall requires the fix status to be tracked and reported for example, whereas a random OTA updated does not.
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Why? It involves a safety system! That needs to be tracked publicly and updated! Nothing more than an OTA - does not mean much when everything is fly by wire and a bug could mean your car does not stop accelerating or something.
Because nothing is being "recalled". It should absolutely be tracked and publicized. But it's fundamentally different than "this car is fundamentally broken and you have to take it back to the manufacturer"
"Recall" with cars is a legal term that means something specific.
> But it's fundamentally different than "this car is fundamentally broken and you have to take it back to the manufacturer"
That's not a criteria for a recall. A recall can be for a small thing completely unrelated to driving safety. Someone else mentioned having a recall to replace a sticker. My most recent recall was to replace the trunk lifts.
"Recall" for a car just means a specific procedure now has to be followed, tracked and reported. It says nothing about the safety criticality of the fix.
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To play devil's advocate, it's only a misleading label when the word "Beta" is omitted.
Not really. If someone says "Full self driving beta" I'm thinking "The goal is full self driving, the current approach should deliver full self driving, beta means that it requires some tweaks and testing".