I think this episode of Yes Minister is rather relevant, albeit EU focused.
Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
751–760 of 809 posts
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#752Earlier quoted context omitted.
>Can anyone really point me out the real problem about the immigrants? This minimises the problem. The UK voters have consistently voted for reduced immigration, with polls showing the preferred number to be somewhere between 0-100,000. Those elected have consistently ignored them which has raised tensions. In the last few years, the UK had around 1 million people net per year. 1 million people is bigger than most ci…
I think there's some conflation happening here (not necessarily from the above comment). Those figures relate to general immigration, which wouldn't be affected by ID schemes since people are given approval by the government to arrive and work in the UK. If the government wanted to reduce regular immigration, it could just decide to award less visas. The ID scheme would only affect irregular immigration which is much…
You are absolutely right to point this out. However, I don't think many people in this thread are actually confused. It's rather clear that this scheme has about as much to do with immigration as the Online Safety Act has to do with protecting children. The UK government is just getting more and more bald-faced about these sorts of things.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#753Can anyone really point me out the real problem about the immigrants? How big is it compared to, for example the lack of funding of the NHS or the hyper funding of other initiatives such as war in Ukraine. Or are those things somehow related? I would be crazily scared to know that immigrant care workers will leave NHS as most hospitals relies on them. The government already made clear they won't pay people more nor w…
The NHS may lack funding, or it may not. But what is certain is that if you know how the NHS operates internally, or you know someone who does, then it's extremely evident that the NHS is severely mismanaged by administrators who definitely are not underfunded. I think saying "the NHS is underfunded" all day is just ignoring the other major issue: even when the NHS has funds, they squander most of them. I don't think…
Not to mention if you have suddenly have 1 million more people a year, many of whom are not in good health, you will suddenly have a lot more demand on that already broken and under-funded system.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#754Earlier quoted context omitted.
My response as to the difference is the 1998 Good Friday agreement. Something that has already been branded as the Brit Card is simply something that wouldn't work in Northern Ireland, and that the name passed any scrutiny say an awful lot. Ireland is not Britain, and people from Northern Ireland can chose to identify as British, Irish or Both by birthright. A "Brit Card" is not something a significant portion of peo…
Irish and British citizenship are de facto equivalent throughout the UK: any Irish person can simply decide to turn up in London without getting any kind of visa or asking any permission from anyone and live, work, or basically do anything a British person is allowed to do. So I’m curious how this will affect Irish people more broadly, not just in NI. Will they need to apply for this card?
The common travel area + Brit_card might result in an interesting pattern where ID is by association rather than territorial location. For instance, as nationalists reject it and use only IRE/EU equivalents where possible. The passport is somewhat similar already. Would people reject services and jobs in N.I.? Completely possible and it already happens with people working "down south" aka down the road.
The civil liberties concerns, particularly in N.I. (historically speaking), are also important to consider. There is quite a high capacity for discriminatory practices in the region from all angles.
On the other side. The British government are lowering themselves to the position of "just another app on my phone". A system riddled with viruses, cyber attacks, etc. Further, what is to stop groups simply setting up and alternative ID system running on btc or something in the future...if this becomes the norm? At first it would be useless and a farce. Later a complete separate system.
Anyway, horrible idea all round. They clearly have not thought this through. Paper ids and loose associations are things I am a fan of in the anglophone world.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#755JR-M just tore this to shreds in a very thorough and historically informed way. Not someone I agree with on a lot of things, however this hit the nail on the head: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6FZKkQR7MCo&list=LL&index=3
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#756Earlier quoted context omitted.
Ni number isn't associated to a photo, and selling or trading them is piss easy
Is this a real thing? It would be essentially identity fraud and having more than a couple of jobs linked on PAYE at the same time would likely raise a flag somewhere in the government
More than one job at a time is entirely legal though.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#757Earlier quoted context omitted.
Showing a birth certificate isn’t a particularly hard bar to pass if you want to fake that you’re a national to be fair. You need just that and a printed letter and there’s nothing an employer will do beyond copying that (afaik you can’t look up a birth certificate and check it’s valid)
But it would need to align with the records associated with their NI number no?
Not if you aren’t PAYE and I’m not sure there are any identity checks if you are.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#758Earlier quoted context omitted.
My response as to the difference is the 1998 Good Friday agreement. Something that has already been branded as the Brit Card is simply something that wouldn't work in Northern Ireland, and that the name passed any scrutiny say an awful lot. Ireland is not Britain, and people from Northern Ireland can chose to identify as British, Irish or Both by birthright. A "Brit Card" is not something a significant portion of peo…
You will not need to carry it around with you. It also seems it'll actually be called Digital ID by the government, this is more a marketing tool, BritCard. (Just clarifying if it helps, I see some misinformation out there).
Huh? Everyone carries their phone everywhere and an ID card on an app is carried everywhere. When you stay at a hotel you might have to produce it, go to a doctors appointment,... and so on
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#759Earlier quoted context omitted.
>What does it buy you? Well, for one thing, it's not a transactional question of what it "buys". It's a matter of principle and defense against future repression or manipulation by politicians on a power trip. For example, given Trump's current and blatant attempts to crush free expression against his own policies and bullshit, or even those who constantly insult and criticize him (whining about it like a little kid…
My point isn't that you should wash it down the toilet because it serves no purpose (of course this is a useful strawman to employ when anyone criticises it); rather, perhaps, that obsessing about it and fully believing it can protect you against eg a Trump presidency isn't very healthy. A bit too much tunnel vision?* > Well, for one thing, it's not a transactional question of what it "buys" Let's not play semantics.…
First, I'm not an American nor do I live in the USA. My mentioning the 1st amendment is because it's the best known example of free speech protection enshrined in the constitutional law of a country.
Secondly, your logic is well off. I never said the 1st or any similar sort of legal protection for free speech is a guaranteed tool against bad government, repression and censorship. Instead it's ONE tool against these things, and better than its complete absence.
Other efforts still matter and in the U.S, we'll just have to see how they pan out, or not. That still doesn't mean that the 1st or any equivalent to it is irrelevant.
By your apparent reasoning, it's worthless because it doesn't guarantee results and that's sort of like having a fireman throw away their fire axe because it's not a sure fix against a house burning down.
Re: Britain to introduce compulsory digital ID for workers
#760Earlier quoted context omitted.
You will not need to carry it around with you. It also seems it'll actually be called Digital ID by the government, this is more a marketing tool, BritCard. (Just clarifying if it helps, I see some misinformation out there).
Huh? Everyone carries their phone everywhere and an ID card on an app is carried everywhere. When you stay at a hotel you might have to produce it, go to a doctors appointment,... and so on
Huh? In countries like Italy it's actually mandatory to have a form of identification on you when in public, this isn't the case.