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Hi Philip, I'm Lachlan from the Cloud Native Ecosystem team at Microsoft. Our team works in the cloud native open-source community with a goal of being great open-source collaborators in these projects and communities, and I’m sorry that this happened. We appreciate your leadership and collaboration on Spegel and see your project solving a real challenge for the cloud native community. I wanted to thank you for your…
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It's in the LICENSE file. With a MIT license, you assign a copyright to the project, or to a certain set of files. The Spegel license attributes copyright to "the Spegel authors", while Peerd attributes it to "Microsoft Corporation". If some of the peerd code was lifted from Spegel, it's blatant stealing. Code attribution is the only thing a MIT license asks people to honor, and Microsoft couldn't even do that.
> If some of the peerd code was lifted from Spegel, it's blatant stealing. Could we say "it's incorrect attribution"? > and Microsoft couldn't even do that. Did you consider it may have been done by an engineer who, in good faith, thought they were giving proper credit by adding it to the README? Would you want that engineer fired because of the bad attribution? It's not like Microsoft is making millions out of this.…
But corporations hiding behind their workers is a no-go. Corporations get to enjoy their successes, and it's fair to hold them accountable for their failures. Least Microsoft can do is a bit of public comms work detailing what they will do to ensure these mistakes are not repeated in the future.
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> Not sure how people fell so hard for "Microsoft Give them a (somewhat) open source IDE and they start believing you are friend of open source in general.
There's also WSL, .NET Core, they own GitHub and continue to host a lot of stuff for free, and more things I'm forgetting. I think the IDE was the least of it frankly. People do seem a bit too gullible because all of these things serve Microsoft's bottom line more than it does open source developers' (isn't it nice that we can now run Linux things right in Windows? How convenient that you don't need to dual boot and…
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It's fine that you think corporations are supposed to work that way, and I don't necessarily disagree. But they don't in practice. They don't feel the consequences of bad actions because of legal economies of scale. They also don't backpropagate consequences from the company's bottom line to the individuals responsible. If you were to rectify this so that it works exactly as you envision, you would have made incredib…
I think the point being made is that the executives are either responsible for the company, or they're not actually running the company at all. Like this isn't some tragedy of the commons situation. This isn't some situation where the company is a cooperative confederation of equal partners. Either shit rolls uphill, or you don't have leadership at all. You don't get to pass the buck on criticism because you made a d…
Executives are not micro-managing day-to-day implementation decisions of every team, no. They set broad strategic goals, the management layers below them decide how to best operationalize those goals, and the layers below those middle managers make specific implementation decisions to execute those operations.
If you want to think of this as "not actually running the company at all", you're free to. The point is that's how the world works.
I want to make a point that might be misinterpreted, so I want to make clear I am not at all defending Microsoft. That said, Microsoft isn't a person and has no agency by itself. It is specific persons/developers/managers violating the licenses and stringing along open source developers in bad faith. Who are these people? Why is the blame not falling on them, specifically?
Hi Philip, I'm Lachlan from the Cloud Native Ecosystem team at Microsoft. Our team works in the cloud native open-source community with a goal of being great open-source collaborators in these projects and communities, and I’m sorry that this happened. We appreciate your leadership and collaboration on Spegel and see your project solving a real challenge for the cloud native community. I wanted to thank you for your…
You are Microsoft. You can do better.
Hi Philip, I'm Lachlan from the Cloud Native Ecosystem team at Microsoft. Our team works in the cloud native open-source community with a goal of being great open-source collaborators in these projects and communities, and I’m sorry that this happened. We appreciate your leadership and collaboration on Spegel and see your project solving a real challenge for the cloud native community. I wanted to thank you for your…
Now that you got caught you are fixing it and writing fancy PR fluff. An org the size of MS should have clear policies and processes of how to handle open source forks like this. Unless we assume “bad faith” here. This is a pretty bad look. I wonder how many other projects are not attributed correctly. Are you checking up on them also or just waiting for the next HN post? That said, the author of Spegel should have u…
As I wrote in my parallel post (https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=43756102): these copyright violations (not giving proper attribution of the license requires it is copyright violation) from Microsoft's side (the more, the "better", and the clearer the message) can be considered de-facto, implicitly stated corporate messages from Microsoft's side that they are from now on officially fine with copyright violations, and thus everybody is from now on free to violate the copyright on every software product that Microsoft has ever produced.
Sez who?
Hi Philip, I'm Lachlan from the Cloud Native Ecosystem team at Microsoft. Our team works in the cloud native open-source community with a goal of being great open-source collaborators in these projects and communities, and I’m sorry that this happened. We appreciate your leadership and collaboration on Spegel and see your project solving a real challenge for the cloud native community. I wanted to thank you for your…
Hi Philip, I'm Lachlan from the Cloud Native Ecosystem team at Microsoft. Our team works in the cloud native open-source community with a goal of being great open-source collaborators in these projects and communities, and I’m sorry that this happened. We appreciate your leadership and collaboration on Spegel and see your project solving a real challenge for the cloud native community. I wanted to thank you for your…