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We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

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Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#751

Post by gfiorav »

eclectic29 wrote: post #196

The media and the VCs are treating Sam like some hero and savior of AI. I’m not getting it. What has he done in life and/or AI to deserve so much respect and admiration? Why don’t top researchers and scientists get equivalent (if not more) respect, admiration and support? It looks like one should strive to become product manager, not an engineer or a scientist.

IMO:

They fired the CEO and didn't even inform Microsoft, who had invested a massive $20 billion. That's a serious lapse in judgment. A company needs leaders who understand business, not just a smart researcher with a sense of ethical superiority. This move by the board was unprofessional and almost childish.

Those board members? Their future on any other board looks pretty bleak. Venture capitalists will think twice before getting involved with anything they have a hand in.

On the other side, Sam did increase the company's revenue, which is a significant achievement. He got offers from various companies and VCs the minute the news went public.

The business community's support for Sam is partly a critique of the board's actions and partly due to the buzz he and his company have created. It's a significant moment in the industry.

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#752

Post by erickhill »

eclectic29 wrote: post #196

The media and the VCs are treating Sam like some hero and savior of AI. I’m not getting it. What has he done in life and/or AI to deserve so much respect and admiration? Why don’t top researchers and scientists get equivalent (if not more) respect, admiration and support? It looks like one should strive to become product manager, not an engineer or a scientist.

Read up on the John Sculley/Michael Spindler days of Apple, and Jobs' return.

I think that's what may be in the minds of several people eagerly watching this eventually-to-be-made David Fincher movie.

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#753

Post by CaptainFever »

mkii wrote: post #530
didip wrote: post #288

Let’s be real here. At the end of the day, what matters more is commercial success and a big payout. AGI is still very far away and the fear mongering is nothing but PR stunt. But the devs need their big payout now. Which explains the mutiny. The “safety” board of directors drank their own koolaid a bit too much.

You can have unsafe AI without AGI.

Of course, it depends on what safety means. Currently it seems to just be a pretext for prudishness and regulation.

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#754

Post by snickerbockers »

eclectic29 wrote: post #196

The media and the VCs are treating Sam like some hero and savior of AI. I’m not getting it. What has he done in life and/or AI to deserve so much respect and admiration? Why don’t top researchers and scientists get equivalent (if not more) respect, admiration and support? It looks like one should strive to become product manager, not an engineer or a scientist.

Journalists really want everything to have a singular inventor. The concept of an organization is very difficult for them to grasp so they attribute everything to the guy at the top. Sam Altman is the latest in a long line of "inventors" which also includes such esteemed personalities as Elon musk, Steve Jobs, etc.

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#755

Post by hn_throwaway_99 »

eclectic29 wrote: post #196

The media and the VCs are treating Sam like some hero and savior of AI. I’m not getting it. What has he done in life and/or AI to deserve so much respect and admiration? Why don’t top researchers and scientists get equivalent (if not more) respect, admiration and support? It looks like one should strive to become product manager, not an engineer or a scientist.

> The media and the VCs are treating Sam like some hero and savior of AI

I wouldn't be so sure. While I think the board handled this process terribly, I think the majority of mainstream media articles I saw were very cautionary regarding the outcome. Examples (and note the second article reports that Paul Graham fired Altman from YC, which I never knew before):

MarketWatch: https://www.marketwatch.com/story/the-openai-debacle-shows-s...

Washington Post: https://www.washingtonpost.com/technology/2023/11/22/sam-alt...

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#756

Post by latexr »

turtle_ wrote: post #734
eclectic29 wrote: post #196

The media and the VCs are treating Sam like some hero and savior of AI. I’m not getting it. What has he done in life and/or AI to deserve so much respect and admiration? Why don’t top researchers and scientists get equivalent (if not more) respect, admiration and support? It looks like one should strive to become product manager, not an engineer or a scientist.

If you grew up in the 90s, you’ll understand: Don’t hate the player, hate the game

The “game” only continues to exist as long as there are “players”. You’re perfectly justified to be discontent with the ones who perpetuate a system you disagree with.

That phrase is nothing more than a dissimulated way of saying “tough luck” or “I don’t care” while trying to act (outdatedly) cool. You don’t need to have grown up in any specific decade to understand its meaning.

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#757

Post by zug_zug »

intended wrote: post #203

From a business sense, Satya was excellent. He made the right calls, fast, with limited information. Things further shifted from plan a to b to… whatever this is. Despite that, MSFT still came out on top. Consider if Satya didn’t say anything. Suppose MSFT stood back and let things play out. That’s a gap for google or some competitor to make a move. To showcase their stability and long term business friendly vision.…

I am not sure why people keep pushing this narrative. It's not obviously false, but there doesn't seem to be much evidence of it.

From where I sit Satya possibly messed up big. He clearly wanted Sam and the Open AI team to join microsoft and they won't now, likely ever.

By offering a standing offer to join MS publicly he gave Sam and OpenAI employees huge leverage to force the board's hand. If he had waited then maybe there would have been an actual fallout that would have lead to people actually joining microsoft.

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#758

Post by theGnuMe »

Larry Summers is an interesting choice. Any ideas why? I know he was Sheryl Sandberg's mentor/professor which gives him a tech connection. However, I've watched him debate Paul Krugman on inflation in some economic lectures and it almost felt like Larry was out of his element as in Larry was outgunned by Paul... but maybe he was having an off day or it was a topic he is not an expert in. But I don't know the history, haven't read either of their books and I am not an economist. But it was something I noticed.. almost like he was out of touch.

That has nothing to do with AI though.

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#759

Post by Kinrany »

prepend wrote: post #677
eclectic29 wrote: post #196

The media and the VCs are treating Sam like some hero and savior of AI. I’m not getting it. What has he done in life and/or AI to deserve so much respect and admiration? Why don’t top researchers and scientists get equivalent (if not more) respect, admiration and support? It looks like one should strive to become product manager, not an engineer or a scientist.

I don’t get that at all. The OpenAI board just seems irrational, immature, indecisive, and many other stupid features you don’t want in a board. I don’t see this so much as an “Altman is amazing” outcome so much as the board is incompetent and doing incompetent things and OpenAI’s products are popular and the boards actions put this products in danger. Not that Altman isn’t cool, I think he’s smart, but I think a sim…

The board is not supposed to be good at executive things, that's why they have CEOs

Re: We have reached an agreement in principle for Sam to return to OpenAI as CEO

#760

Post by jafitc »

OpenAI's Future and Viability

- OpenAI has damaged their brand and lost trust, but may still become a hugely successful company if they build great products

- OpenAI looks stronger now with a more professional board, but has fundamentally transformed into a for-profit focused on commercializing LLMs

- OpenAI still retains impressive talent and technology assets and could pivot into a leading AI provider if managed well

---

Sam Altman's Leadership

- Sam emerged as an irreplaceable CEO with overwhelming employee loyalty, but may have to accept more oversight

- Sam has exceptional leadership abilities but can be manipulative; he will likely retain control but have to keep stakeholders aligned

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Board Issues

- The board acted incompetently and destructively without clear reasons or communication

- The new board seems more reasonable but may struggle to govern given Sam's power

- There are still opposing factions on ideology and commercialization that will continue battling

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Employee Motivations

- Employees followed the money trail and Sam to preserve their equity and careers

- Peer pressure and groupthink likely also swayed employees more than principles

- Mission-driven employees may still leave for opportunities at places like Anthropic

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Safety vs Commercialization

- The safety faction lost this battle but still has influential leaders wanting to constrain the technology

- Rapid commercialization beat out calls for restraint but may hit snags with model issues

---

Microsoft Partnership

- Microsoft strengthened its power despite not appearing involved in the drama

- OpenAI is now clearly beholden to Microsoft's interests rather than an independent entity

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