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FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

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Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#741
post #397

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I understand it, he laid hands on the officer, then struggled against arrest. He had a gun on him, which is not in itself a problem, but he had already broken the law 3 times by this point and the fact he had a gun on him instantly escalates the potential threat. They don't know if he has multiple guns on him or just the one. Supposedly one of the videos shows him reaching for some black object. I don't kno…

I have seen the videos. He was already on the ground, fixated by several ICE agents, when he was shot 10(!) times. That was after he had been peppersprayed and beaten to the head. At no point did he actually draw or reach for his gun. There was absolutely no reason to shoot him. > With any luck investigation will reveal more details. Kristi Noem said: "This looks like a situation where an individual arrived at the sc…

The Sig P320 that an agent took off of him went off while it was in a federal cop's hand. This is the same Sig P320 that the US Army rejected and was mass recalled for going off on its own.

Unfortunately, when the shot went off he was still fighting with them, actively resisting and not complying. Fighting with federal cops like that is a good way to get killed. He played a stupid game and won a stupid prize.

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#742

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would help if they stopped holding demonstrations in front of facilities with huge amounts of facial recognition technology. Protesting is not something you should do "casually."

> Protesting is not something you should do "casually” Neither is violently undermining our Constitutional order. These folks should be on notice that they will be prosecuted. If we played by Trump’s book, we’d charge them with treason and then let them appeal against the death penalty for the rest of their lives.

If Trump actually wanted to violently undermine the constitutional order there would be a lot of dead judges by now.

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#743

I have seen anti-Signal FUD all over the place since it was discovered that protesters have been coordinating on Signal. Here’s the facts: - Protesters have been coordinating using Signal - Breaches of private Signal groups by journalists and counter protesters were due to poor opsec and vetting - If the feds have an eye into those groups, it’s likely that they gained access in the same way as well as through informa…

Thanks. This really should be the top comment.

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#744
post #740

What is it like in the US these days? I'm on the outside (occasionally) looking in, and it looks like something out of European history class! The ice seem to have roughly the same priorities and roughly the same methodology as the SA had in the beginning. Is stuff really as bad as it looks or are media somehow exaggerating things? I mean I saw the pretti videos and it certainly seems to corroborate what media is say…

> As a European I'm also somewhat confused. I always thought that the reason the second amendment was made into such a big deal was because Americans felt they needed to be able to protect themselves in case the government ran amok. Americans, yes - not illegal immigrant invaders. As it would turn out, American citizens aren't ready to die for these people just yet.

The man killed was not an illegal or immigrant

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#745

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Is stuff really as bad as it looks or are media somehow exaggerating things? If you think what you've seen is bad, consider how bad the stuff you don't see is, and then consider how bad it is for those who aren't the type to post on HN.

Also consider that there are 340 million people in the US. With that sort of population size, you can construct whatever narrative you want out of daily video clips of 1-in-a-million events. >the type to post on HN. When's the last time you saw a Trump supporter on this site? The userbase here is considerably further left than a very left-wing state such as California. That will very much be reflected in what gets po…

> When's the last time you saw a Trump supporter on this site?

Today, several. They made themselves known in several threads related to recent events.

It's against the guidelines to call out posts/posters, but you can use the HN Algolia to list the most popular threads from this week/month and you'll see plenty of them.

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#746

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> to follow federal agents around, harass them, and prevent them from doing their jobs. That’s textbook Obstruction of Justice. It is illegal to prevent an officer from doing their job. Filming officiers performing their jobs is not obstruction, even if it does make them uncomfortable. If it makes their jobs harder that's only because they know what they're doing is unpopular and don't want to be known to have done i…

> Filming officiers performing their jobs is not obstruction This is irrelevant, because many people have been observed physically obstructing officers, whether or not they were filming at the time. > If it makes their jobs harder Have you heard the constant blowing of whistles in these videos? Did you know that protesters have organized the mass 3d-printing and distribution of these whistles ( https://www.minnpost.c…

> This is irrelevant, because many people have been observed physically obstructing officers, whether or not they were filming at the time.

Not the last guy they executed. He was recording, then backed away when an officer approached him. Then he got dogpiled, his holstered gun was taken, and then he was shot repeatedly.

> Have you heard the constant blowing of whistles in these videos? Did you know that protesters have organized the mass 3d-printing and distribution of these whistles?

I'm quite aware of the intentionally annoying whistles. You're taking a pretty broad interpretation of "interference." I didn't realize that feds had a protected right to a calm and quiet work environment.

> I'm not mistaken in my understanding that Tim Walz is a Democrat, am I? The one making public speeches falsely claiming that ICE aren't LEO and encouraging "peaceful protest" without mentioning anything about obstruction of justice or resisting arrest?

Yeah, Walz is a weak Democrat who can't even condemn the organization killing and abducting his State's citizens. Exactly the kind of politician voters are tired of. All he can say over and over is to "not take the bait" by resisting occupation more forcefully.

> And you're aware that the Signal groups in question are alleged to include Democratic state officials and a campaign advisor?

I've not heard that alleged, but it wouldn't be surprising for some to be monitoring the situation. If you mean to imply that Democrat officials are organizing the resistance then that's laughable. If you're a Conservative then there are only a handful of Dems you should be afraid of, and the rest of the Dems will help you make sure they're not too influential.

> For that matter, exactly what do you mean by "abolishing ICE"? Should it not be replaced?

A more focused INS under the DoJ would be a good reset. A paramilitary with twitchy trigger fingers is no way to enforce any law, much less something as nonviolent and bureaucratic as immigration. If someone is being violent, send the Police, hold a trial. If you need to sort out immigration status you can send a pencil pusher to get papers in order.

> Should immigration law not be enforced? Should the USA allow everyone to reside within its borders who wishes to do so, with no barriers to entry?

No barriers? No. Extremely low ones though, absolutely. You do realize that almost all undocumented people living in the US are on overstayed visas, right? We let them in after checking they weren't dangerous, then they started working and living here. Now they make up a sizable chunk of the population. Clearly our immigration system is broken if it leaves this many residents undocumented. And your proposed solution is strict enforcement?

Imagine, if you will, applying this standard to, say, speeding. Repeated instances of speeding result in increasing fines, and eventually revocation of your license. That's what the law says! Should we not enforce this law?? Well. If we used cars' and phones' GPS and cameras to reconstruct a few days of driving behavior, then handed out punishment as dictated by law, 90% of drivers would instantly lose their license. Half of the population would be unable to go to work, buy food, of get their kids to school. It would be a disaster of historic scale. The problem then, is the law. To put it more succinctly: I am not a proponent of enforcing bad laws, and neither is just about anyone else here in reality.

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#747
post #572

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> something that is perfectly legal The goal is to prevent ICE / BP from doing their jobs. Which I rather suspect is not actually legal. Thinking they're incompetent doesn't change that. Thinking the specific laws they're (nominally) enforcing are evil doesn't change that. Thinking that national borders are fundamentally illegitimate doesn't change that. Perhaps the FBI had been ignoring this out of incompetence. Per…

Indeed, as sibling commenter notes, it's not to prevent ICE from doing their jobs. Observers do not take physical actions to block ICE/CBP. Observers are there to 1) get the name & some other info from the person being abducted so that their family can be contacted 2) record the encounter so that ICE/CBP has some check on their behavior, or legal action can be taken in the future to prosecute them for violence and de…

> Observers do not take physical actions to block ICE/CBP.

As clearly seen in multiple videos, including at least one video of almost every major incident we're supposed to get outraged about, yes, they clearly do.

> Not to mention they keep releasing people with no phone & no jacket, even no shoes, into the zero or negative degree weather we've been having.

How come the cold weather doesn't justify ICE wearing "masks" which often appear to just be face/neck warmers?

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#748
post #596
post #523

There seems to be wild speculation about freedom of speech rights or hacking Signal. The FBI simply joined groupchats and read them. This is trivial stuff.

Do you mean just technically trivial? I agree with that. If you mean more broadly trivial, I see that quite differently. An administration that has repeatedly abused its power in order to intimidate and punish political opponents is opening an investigation into grassroots political opponents. That feels worth being concerned about.

[flagged]

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#749

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Protesting is not something you should do "casually” Neither is violently undermining our Constitutional order. These folks should be on notice that they will be prosecuted. If we played by Trump’s book, we’d charge them with treason and then let them appeal against the death penalty for the rest of their lives.

If Trump actually wanted to violently undermine the constitutional order there would be a lot of dead judges by now.

Here is a more pedantic description then for you - "undermine the constitutional order by employing elevated (to various degree) amount of violence."

Re: FBI is investigating Minnesota Signal chats tracking ICE

#750
post #580

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's straight up corrupt third world country stuff.

How is it corrupt? The DA chose to resign , they weren't forced out.

I as someone with power over you will repeatedly force you to do an illegal and or immoral act. I have doubt you have the balls to resign rather than follow along, but if you do resign I hope you don't say you were forced out. Be honest.
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