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Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

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Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#741

Post by hahn-kev »

reubenmorais wrote: post #723
acchow wrote: post #720

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> they always rely on trust in an off-chain oracle or custodian. At that point, a shared ledger implemented with traditional databases / protocols would be faster, easier, and more transparent. International wire money transfer is far too difficult today. And after you've sent it, you still need to wait minutes (hours?) for the receiving end's bank to actually process the wire and move it into the recipient's account…

I can transfer money from Europe to Brazil in seconds with Wise. I press the button and the money is nearly instantly available in the Brazilian account via PIX. The same in the reverse direction is possible but only if you have a more modern bank in Europe, eg. N26 or Revolut.

My understanding is that Wise isn't a true international transfer. Wise has money already in a Brazilian account, and when they receive money in their European account then they send you money from their Brazilian account. If they don't have enough money in that Brazilian account then it can't be instant like it is today.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#743

Post by LMYahooTFY »

taberiand wrote: post #500
smoovb wrote: post #361

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Counterpoint. Tether has grown into one of the most profitable, well funded companies on the planet. Their past growing pains are irrelevant to where they are now. They make $30-50 million per day with just 200 employees. They are the 18th largest holder of US debt, ahead of UAE and Germany. Last year, Tether achieved $14 billion in profit, surpassing Pfizer, Tesla, and BlackRock. https://www.bitget.com/news/detail/1…

The pinnacle of fake it till you make it. Still a scam.

How exactly is it a scam now? Did they somehow fake treasury purchases? Can you describe something scam like about their business which doesn't also apply to JP Morgan?

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#745

Post by knorker »

soared wrote: post #690
knorker wrote: post #536

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Over the last few years, stablecoins have become a preferred means to hold and move money (for convenience, etc). Huh? In the western world this is nonsense. I move 6-7 digits regularly, internationally, even between continents, for free. Convenience of cryptocurrency? Lol. Maybe if I want to send money to Nigeria or North Korea. Cryptocurrency was never more convenient. It's cheaper than Western Union when that's…

How are you doing it for free, how long does it take, and what happens if something goes wrong? These are the things companies want. With current methods you must take on risk to move money cheaper, faster, or without chargebacks/etc.

> How are you doing it for free

How do you mean? Some banks and bank accounts don't charge.

> how long does it take

It depends. Some transfer types are bank opening hours only, though then it's seconds. Some are batch overnight ones. For some use cases you can do an "internal" transfer internationally instantly, with an international bank. And then on both sides it's domestic instant. With others you don't need that trick, and it's just instant by default.

While this has greatly improved (part of what I meant by stablecoin supposedly being more relevant in the last few years being nonsense), yes the overnight thing is something that's not perfected yet.

Compare this to stock sales. We're down to T+1 settlement now, depending on the market. Imagine someone saying we need to replace the whole idea of money in order to reduce from T+5. We don't.

> without chargebacks

Cryptocurrency advocates talk about chargebacks as if it's a law of nature they managed to find a loophole in.

What exact use case are you thinking of? Customer payments to a business? If you want to reduce (though not eliminate) chargebacks and risk, those businesses are already declining CC, and only accept debit card and bank transfers as payment?

There's a reason most companies don't want to do that, because there's a good reason customers choose to just go elsewhere if they do.

Chargebacks were not an accident, just like "being stuck in KYC" was a deliberate design choice.

"If we do this then we can't get stuck in KYC" is not clever, it's just indistinguishible from crime, and quite possibly is crime. (structuring)

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#746

Post by grey-area »

lacy_tinpot wrote: post #445
rebolek wrote: post #379

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In EU, regulations are heavy and the result is I can send money instantly for free. That’s actually what the regulations are for. To protect free trade from bad actors.

Protection and control are indistinguishable. And secondly what if the State is a bad actor? "Protecting" free trade from "bad actors" is just an extension of the state to control what "free trade" is from what it considers "bad actors". Bad behavior does exist, but current technology far exceeds the capacity of bureaucracy to implement free trade, protection from bad actors, and most importantly Trust. The state its…

If the state is a bad actor good luck with using cryptocurrencies to avoid that. You will be retrospectively controlled if necessary.

The state as a bad actor is controlled by democracy, not technology.

Aside from that, in payments the bad actors you need to actually worry about are malicious vendors and customers and hackers stealing your details and your money. None of which Cryptocurrencies make better, mostly they make that worse, because they were designed as digital cash.

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#747

Post by grey-area »

ENGNR wrote: post #648
asats wrote: post #337

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Still doesn't answer why you would need any crypto here. Why can't the USD transferred to stripe just be a record in an SQL database saying customer X has N USD in the account, and transferring that around could be done instantly at zero cost by changing an sql row.

There are all sorts of protections around who can be a custodian of someone’s money (for good reason) However there are use cases like running a marketplace, where the platform would like to be able to direct the flow, maybe hold things temporarily in case there are multiple transactions or to split a transaction up between different clients, before paying it out daily or weekly as a lump sum. Often it’s just to avoi…

So, we're just going to pretend those regulations don't exist for cryptocurrencies too?

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#749

Post by whimsicalism »

idontwantthis wrote: post #401
SR2Z wrote: post #368

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> At that point, a shared ledger implemented with traditional databases / protocols would be faster, easier, and more transparent. Except they are frequently _not_. I dislike crypto on principle, but you can't look at the exorbitant transfer fees and latency that a lot of banks charge for common transactions (Visa/MasterCard are especially bad) and say that crypto has no potential. Yes, it would be easier if we could…

> Yes, it would be easier if we could just trust our banks to offer instant settlement and very low fees, but they don't. I think everywhere but America has already figured this out. Instant bank payments are pretty standard everywhere else, even third world countries.

not between countries

Re: Stripe Launches L1 Blockchain: Tempo

#750

Post by whimsicalism »

XorNot wrote: post #609
davidlee1435 wrote: post #526

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right now, the stability of your currency is mostly dictated by where you were born My point is stablecoins give you choice to opt out of that. The only way to opt out before was very expensive

This is as wrong as everytime someone says "the benefit of Bitcoin is you can just walk all your assets across the border!" It fundamentally misunderstands how foreign exchange works, or how government backed currency works. You cannot "opt out" of the local currency: period. It is the only currency which can extinguish tax obligations. And even if it wasn't government backed, you can't trade in a currency no one wan…

you’ll note that many countries that impose capital controls have large informal economies. this is not a question of theory, there are many countries where millions of people do hold significant sums in dollars and other foreign currencies, regardless of whether they fulfill tax obligation. enough people do this and you also get the informal economy transacting in these currencies. you are “proving” the non-existence of something that in actuality is practiced by millions of people every single day.
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