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US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

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Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#741

Post by mulmen »

supercheetah wrote: post #497
jasmer wrote: post #461

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Moral relativism between US and China is unfathomable. They are not remotely comparable on the whole. China has a Dictator, a total absence of a Justice System, total surveillance and censorship, and large swaths of the population of some regions in concentration camps, a large number of individual dedicated to holding in place that apparatus. Meanwhile you're free to walk down the street and tell the US President he…

No such comparison was being made. The issue is whether or not the US or Chinese government affect our lives more, and since there's no danger of China trying to invade the US anytime soon, it's obviously the former. The Chinese don't care about watching the average person.

> The Chinese don't care about watching the average person.

Citation needed. How much value does intimate knowledge of individual preference and habit have for psyops? How much of an advantage does China gain when they convince a democratic electorate that their actions are no big deal?

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#742

Post by mulmen »

smcl wrote: post #294
kazmerb wrote: post #186

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd rather my own government spy on me than China. I'd rather Hannibal fucking Lecter be able to see me through my webcam than China.

Why, though? Your own government has far more power over you and far more reason to be interested in you than China ever would (unless you're a prominent critic of China, politically connected, or involved in military intelligence or something like that). I mean I don't want anyone spying on me, but I'm less worried about China targetting me than the Czech government (where I live) or the UK one (where I'm from).

Because in a democracy I have the ability to control my government. Far more so than if I lived under a dictatorship.

> far more reason to be interested in you than China ever would

I think this is naive. Psyops are real and are made more effective with knowledge of personal preference and habits. It is likely that Chinese intelligence has targeted literally everyone on the Internet in some way.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#743

Post by apelapan »

Kon-Peki wrote: post #690
doodlebugging wrote: post #682

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that most people will decide that Olympic sized pools must be big but it doesn't give a layman any clue to just how large a volume they contain in some contexts where you find the comparison used. For example, I made a comment about a similar comparison in a post here on HN a while ago because their example was simply ridiculous [0]. The author in that article referenced the volume of a large body of water as…

The funny thing about Olympic-sized swimming pools is that they are so big that they are nearly useless except for the relatively rare elite swimming competition. So they are actually far more uncommon than you might expect, and are usually built with configurable “walls” so that they can be made smaller for everyday use!

Olympic pools are amazing for casual swimming! The water has quite different dynamics, compared to a regular pool. Unfortunately they are expensive to build and operate, due to their size, so they are quite rare.

I treat myself to an Olympic swim every now and then, even though it means driving to the next city and expensive parking. Highly recommend it!

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#746

Post by jasmer »

troops_h8r wrote: post #610
jasmer wrote: post #468

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They are 'touchable', there is oversight, and their powers are very limited. Give me an example of Americans who have been materially harmed by those agencies? And what was the damage? Have Americans been oppressed, slandered for political gain, wrongly imprisoned, illegally targeted by police because of NSA activity? I think it's doubtful for anything other than a few incidents; the proportionality of these tradeoff…

See: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/COINTELPRO Naively, one might say "ah but that ended in 1971!" - but let me put it this way: if you spotted a cockroach in your house, you'd be a fool to think that was the only one. Also: the oversight/limits you're protected by could disappear some day, they're imaginary and socially constructed. Sure, you trust our current government to handle these powers responsibly, (though yo…

"the oversight/limits you're protected by could disappear some day, they're imaginary and socially constructed."

This is the straw man of all straw mans.

You could have a Totalitarian Overlord someday, after all it's all 'socially constructed'. You'd have a million other, worse problems on your hands.

That your making that argument and can't provide examples of specific harm despite widespread powers of the state is problematic.

Creeping authoritarianism is a general problem, not an NSA problem.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#747

Post by philliphaydon »

bailoon wrote: post #673
mulmen wrote: post #272

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'd rather be spied on by a western democracy than China. Our intelligence agencies are out of control but there's still better mechanisms for reigning them in than China.

> I'd rather be spied on by a western democracy than China. Why? What has china done that's worse? Did they nuke a country? Wipe out entire races of people? Did those nasty chinese invade dozens of countries? There is nothing inherent in a western democracy that makes it good. > Our intelligence agencies are out of control but there's still better mechanisms for reigning them in than China. There are no mechanisms fo…

> China isn't going to arrest you and put you in jail.

Unless you’re Chinese. Now that we know China has secret police stations all round the world.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#749

Post by 15155 »

Axsuul wrote: post #696
smegger001 wrote: post #514

Earlier quoted context omitted.

the problem is as long as the target you send up are cheaper for you to produce than the countermeasure used against them you can spam your opponent and bleed them financially while having a minimal impact on your own budget. Air to air missiles cost on the order of $300,000.00 weather balloons cost and order of magnitude less.

What about the autocannon using A10s?

The first balloon flew at FL600+: no A10 is touching it with a ground attack cannon from a 20,000 foot spread in altitude.

Re: US jet shoots down unknown object flying off Alaska coast

#750

Post by kimburgess »

exDM69 wrote: post #704
kypro wrote: post #656

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm not sure what the situation is in other European countries, but in the UK we use different units depending on the use so most people are use to working with both imperial and metric. Perhaps with the exception of fahrenheit most people here will know what you mean if you use units like feet and will often even prefer thinking in feet over metres for certain things. Personally I default to feet for something like…

No, not many people in continental Europe are comfortable with miles, feet and inches. But sailboat length is traditionally measured in feet. Same for aircraft altitude. So sailors and aviators are more likely to use feet (and nautical miles) as measurement.

Nautical miles have nothing to do with imperial units.

It's now defined in reference to SI meter, but it originates as 1/60th of a degree of latitude.

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