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'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

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Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#741

Post by vsareto »

spamizbad wrote: post #375
gorgoiler wrote: post #216

It’s knives out time, I’m afraid, for any activist or negative employee. I am flabbergasted by the number of people I’ve worked with who are flat out ungrateful when it comes to their relationship with their employer either being outright miserable and surly, or constantly virtue signalling about hypothetical problems that just drag everyone down the purity spiral. They get paid and they push code but they seem to th…

Man, where have you worked? It sounds awful. Is this a SV specific type of personality? I feel like a low output dev who complains constantly wouldn't last 6 months before landing on a PIP. My experience, most "dead weight" employees tend to be quiet types who never rock the boat. They want to just keep flying under the radar. They say please and thank you, they show up to company events, but just.... don't produce.…

You just sound like you don’t quiet people and are trying to justify it. You don’t need to rock the boat if it’s smooth sailing. Do you want everyone complaining and trying to change things?

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#742

Post by pcthrowaway »

lhorie wrote: post #530
fefe23 wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have met a few of those people, but every single one of them needed a justification. Some told me they felt wronged by the company somehow. For example they had experienced bullying, or didn't get promoted when they felt they should have been, or they had contributed something and then it got cut from the product, something like that in most cases. Now didn't feel they owed the company anything. Yet others said the…

People will always make up reasons if the tone of the conversation feels adversarial, but just spend a week in r/cscareerquestions to see the unfiltered sentiment: lots of people literally bragging about working 30 or even 20 hours per week as a full time employee, or who explicitly call out "slacking off" as a reason for preferring WFH. "Rest and vest". Etc.

/r/overemployed and Blind are even worse TBH, people in /r/cscareerquestions are often just trying to strike a somewhat tolerable WLB

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#743

Post by thereare5lights »

groffee wrote: post #647
darth_avocado wrote: post #567

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am not a dead weight and I’ll never be, but I also do absolutely bare minimum to not get fired. And by bare minimum, I mean, I will always finish my work in the time it is expected to be finished. And if the expectations are higher, I’ll move on to another job. I do this as a way to get back at corporate America. Too many companies get away with sucking out their employees dry and firing them once they can’t meet t…

> I am not a dead weight and I’ll never be, but I also do absolutely bare minimum to not get fired. That's the literal definition of dead weight.

> That's the literal definition of dead weight.

No.

literal definition

> the weight of an inert person or thing.

The metaphor refers to people that do nothing and are only a burden. Dead weight cannot positively contribute.

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#744

Post by shanusmagnus »

pojzon wrote: post #641
fefe23 wrote: post #245

As a consultant, I come around a bit. I have seen many companies with very poor productivity, and in zero of those cases was it laziness of the employees. In fact they usually would have loved to be more productive. Nobody wants to spend their life being dead weight. But as companies grow they install more and more rules and regulations that end up making sure nothing ever gets done. It is not unusual to meet "develo…

I really have trouble understanding why ppl should dream about labor / fulfilment at work. There are so many ways to find a real meaning. Be a great person, help others, read a book, do yoga, help kids with homework, plant a tree, build something with own hands, grow food, clean-up trash. So many things to keep you busy. Work is just a necessity to do something that actually matters in the longer run (for majority at…

I assume because you literally spend most of your life there, and if it doesn't mean something, that is ... awful?

I mean, there have been times / places in history where you work so that you have enough money to not die; and you enjoy your life with whatever pittance is left afterward.

I doubt anyone reading this website is in such a time or place.

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#745

Post by amzn-throw »

thenightcrawler wrote: post #105
amzn-throw wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's not a conspiracy theory, I work for Amazon - for a decade. I love it - best job I've ever had. And historically, while it's been a tough place to work, we've always been able to attract top talent. Partially - impactful work. Partially - stock doubles every year. Well guess what happened in 2020/2021? Despite incredible perseverance through the Pandemic, the stock stopped doubling. Meanwhile, Microsoft, Meta,…

I think Amazon would have a better rep if they didn't have a stack ranking system.

Every competitive has a stack ranking system whether they admit it or not.

They put lipstick on a pig but everyone's getting ranked and the lowest performers getting weeded out.

The whole "People get fired even if they're doing a good job just by being a low performer on a strong team" is an edge case that happens INCREDIBLY rarely but when it does gets all the attention.

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#746

Post by netheril96 »

pojzon wrote: post #641
fefe23 wrote: post #245

As a consultant, I come around a bit. I have seen many companies with very poor productivity, and in zero of those cases was it laziness of the employees. In fact they usually would have loved to be more productive. Nobody wants to spend their life being dead weight. But as companies grow they install more and more rules and regulations that end up making sure nothing ever gets done. It is not unusual to meet "develo…

I really have trouble understanding why ppl should dream about labor / fulfilment at work. There are so many ways to find a real meaning. Be a great person, help others, read a book, do yoga, help kids with homework, plant a tree, build something with own hands, grow food, clean-up trash. So many things to keep you busy. Work is just a necessity to do something that actually matters in the longer run (for majority at…

Well, I care about raises. I can coast along in my current role, but I want more money, so I need to do impactful work.

If I can earn more on some side work or investment and those earnings are stable enough, then I too will not care about work.

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#747

Post by onlyrealcuzzo »

winphone1974 wrote: post #248
naravara wrote: post #212

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of all the types of meetings that could be emails, stand-ups are at the very bottom of the list. A well run, efficient stand-up can head off a day's worth of productivity sucking emails and Slack messages with a 10 min conversation.

10 minutes x everyone on the team x scheduled time for all x disruption and context switch loss I like in person updates myself, but it's not as obvious of a cost calc as you present. There is definitely a place for async, written updates

The Hallmark if a bad manager is having zero consideration for their subordinates.

I find bad managers usually can't grasp the cost of interruptions from meetings - because their work isn't interrupted from meeting - because their work IS meetings.

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#748

Post by elevaet »

granshaw wrote: post #578
onion2k wrote: post #403

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If somebody wants to pay me $300k to work 4 hours a week, I'll happily take the deal. Would you take that over $300k to work 40 hours doing something you actually care about? I don't think I would.

Few people understand how much of a golden ticket this would be… Do you have any aspirations to build something of your own at all, whether profitable or not? Well you’ve now been given 300k/year of funding without giving up any equity, with the only condition that you put in 4hrs/week for your “job” Or maybe you like fixing houses? Same thing, etc etc

> Few people understand how much of a golden ticket this would be…

Uh.. I think you got that backwards. Nearly anyone would recognize that as a major golden ticket!

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#749

Post by [deleted] »

WalterBright wrote: post #625
fefe23 wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have met a few of those people, but every single one of them needed a justification. Some told me they felt wronged by the company somehow. For example they had experienced bullying, or didn't get promoted when they felt they should have been, or they had contributed something and then it got cut from the product, something like that in most cases. Now didn't feel they owed the company anything. Yet others said the…

People who do things they know are wrong will always conjure up an explanation that absolves them of any culpability. They'll even believe it themselves. For example, people who steal office supplies from work always have a good reason they tell themselves. For another, all the people who post on Hackernews justifying cheating in college. My favorite bullshit excuse was cheating was justified because the professor di…

[deleted]

Re: 'Too many employees, but few work': Pichai, Zuckerberg sound the alarm

#750

Post by queuebert »

fefe23 wrote: post #245

As a consultant, I come around a bit. I have seen many companies with very poor productivity, and in zero of those cases was it laziness of the employees. In fact they usually would have loved to be more productive. Nobody wants to spend their life being dead weight. But as companies grow they install more and more rules and regulations that end up making sure nothing ever gets done. It is not unusual to meet "develo…

I feel this in my bones, as I'm having to fill out a 27-page document to ask permission to use a new piece of software on the intranet.
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