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Stripe bans Trump campaign

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Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#741

Post by didip »

roenxi wrote: post #739
tessierashpool wrote: post #729

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what is the evidence for this? > > ...this is a not a mob out for literal blood. No, this was 100% a mob out for literal blood. There is a STAGGERING amount of evidence. There's video of a large crowd of the rioters chanting "hang Mike Pence!" They erected a gallows with a noose outside the Capitol. There's video of people yelling that they came to get Pence and Pelosi. Squads of milita wore tactical armor and helm…

> No, this was 100% a mob out for literal blood. There is a STAGGERING amount of evidence. 100%? Literally all of them? Every one? I'm not looking for a metaphorical response here. Which parts of your response are backed actual evidence and which parts are assumptions based on your instincts and filling in blanks?

r/DataHoarder archives a lot of data about this riot.

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#742

Post by dragonsky »

mjevans wrote: post #501
baumandm wrote: post #467

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Unfortunately I don't think it's a stretch to suggest that a large percentage of people across the political spectrum lack basic civics knowledge.

We make people take a test to drive. People should have to take a Civics based test to vote. If someone wants to vote but fails the civics test, they should then immediately qualify for a minimum living wage job to go back to public education and get paid for getting at least an 80% grade at whatever grade level they're working at (obviously with either enrollment at lower grade levels, classification as disability i…

Why don't you try ensuring that everybody votes? Seems to work for Australia. You end up with politicians who are interested in appealing to the broadest range of voters rather than trying to make it difficult for the people who would vote against them to vote.

If you think people are too stupid to vote, then you're not trying hard enough to ensure that they have the issues explained to them.

How easy is it to go from "you don't understand civics" so you can't vote, to "you have the wrong religion" or "you have the wrong skin colour" you can't vote.

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#743

Post by bilbo0s »

lliamander wrote: post #715
trustfundbaby wrote: post #279

I was on the fence about this, but reading the comments convinced me it was the absolute right decision. The fact that all these institutions just allowed this horrible hateful speech for four years, in the name of free speech etc, despite all the harassment, harm (mental and otherwise) it caused to so many people in America actually emboldened so many to the extent that now that they crossed this invisible line, the…

The left (including prominent politicians and media figures) are more than willing to provide cover or excuse political violence conducted for their side, and left-wing extremists used FB, Twitter, etc. to coordinate their actions over the past summer. This is not about removing "hate". This is about removing political opposition. The WalkAway campaign's FB page was removed, despite no violent content. The Articles o…

I'm one of those people who has always loathed both liberals and conservatives, but the attack on the capitol went way too far. You guys want to march around and yell in the streets, I actually don't have a problem with it. I find it annoying, but as long as you're not killing anyone, I don't care. However, you want to go into congress and subvert the Constitutional order? Yeah, that's a whole different issue.

I'm sorry if the conservatives can't understand the difference between BLM people yelling in the streets, and Trump people searching the capitol for senators and representatives to stop a Constitutionally mandated vote count. (Actually that was a lie, I'm not sorry. I don't give a mosquito's dick about either of you. I was just trying to be nice.) I'm done trying to explain the difference to these people, and I think these terrorists have pushed a lot of people off the fence with me. People are fed up. You don't understand the difference? You think too much of it's unjustified? Too bad. This is the way it's gotta be. We're not going to live in anarchy because conservatives and liberals want to play out crips and bloods on our republic.

End rant.

Edit: Man I'm getting old. That reads like I just told some kids to get off my lawn. But that's how I feel.

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#744

Post by eecc »

trustfundbaby wrote: post #279

I was on the fence about this, but reading the comments convinced me it was the absolute right decision. The fact that all these institutions just allowed this horrible hateful speech for four years, in the name of free speech etc, despite all the harassment, harm (mental and otherwise) it caused to so many people in America actually emboldened so many to the extent that now that they crossed this invisible line, the…

Free speech is about protecting the tolerant from an abusive and intolerant state, not to allow the intolerant to insult and attack the tolerant. A much smarter thinker called Popper came up with an eponymous paradox about this

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#745

Post by onion2k »

roenxi wrote: post #739
tessierashpool wrote: post #729

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> what is the evidence for this? > > ...this is a not a mob out for literal blood. No, this was 100% a mob out for literal blood. There is a STAGGERING amount of evidence. There's video of a large crowd of the rioters chanting "hang Mike Pence!" They erected a gallows with a noose outside the Capitol. There's video of people yelling that they came to get Pence and Pelosi. Squads of milita wore tactical armor and helm…

> No, this was 100% a mob out for literal blood. There is a STAGGERING amount of evidence. 100%? Literally all of them? Every one? I'm not looking for a metaphorical response here. Which parts of your response are backed actual evidence and which parts are assumptions based on your instincts and filling in blanks?

Not everyone in the mob was out for blood, but the mob as a collective group was. The mob killed a police officer. Anyone who was part of the mob is partly to blame for that.

No one can take part in a group action and then claim they're not responsible for what the group has done. When people act as a group they have to accept responsibility for the group's actions.

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#746

Post by roenxi »

slg wrote: post #740
roenxi wrote: post #736

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There were gallows, bombs, armour, zip ties and guns brought to the protest. How many guns, bombs and zip ties? Was it even enough protestors to be called a minority who bought bombs? The press would love a few photos of people with guns storming the capital, because those that I've seen look like very poorly behaved tourists with souvenirs and selfies. Gallows happen to be a traditional prop at protests (eg, [0]).…

>How many guns, bombs and zip ties? Was it even enough protestors to be called a minority who bought bombs? Stop and take a second to listen to yourself. Is there an acceptable numbers of guns, bombs, and zip ties that are intended to be used on the leaders of this country?

No, there isn't. But there is also no reason to assume that a protestor with no gun, bomb or ziptie is equivalent to one that has one.

Lone wolves and troublemakers out to get Congresspeople exist. There might be a few in the mob. But the mob itself isn't made up of people like that. This is the same logic that was being applied to protestors all through 2020. It is hard to get away from the BLM protests being peaceful even with burning buildings in the background.

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#747

Post by damnyou »

lliamander wrote: post #730
dboreham wrote: post #664

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They didn't tell millions of people that the election had been outright stolen. Not even in 2016 when it pretty much was.

2016 was stolen? by whom, the Russians? Here's the thing: How can you expect any one to believe on the one hand that for four years we have had an illegitimate president who is simultaneously a Russian agent and Orange Hitler... and yet tell me that 2020 was a perfectly run election? Are you telling me that patriotic Americans across the country would not due their duty to remove an illegitimate President by any mean…

I don't think Russia hacked servers or anything like that. But the fact is that Russia made a very large and active effort to interfere in the US election, as laid out very clearly in the Senate report. It's not something we consider stealing in the ordinary sense, but that's only because it's significantly more sophisticated than what the MAGA mob is currently trying to do.

(The US has interfered in other countries' elections before, of course.)

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#748

Post by roenxi »

didip wrote: post #741
roenxi wrote: post #739

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No, this was 100% a mob out for literal blood. There is a STAGGERING amount of evidence. 100%? Literally all of them? Every one? I'm not looking for a metaphorical response here. Which parts of your response are backed actual evidence and which parts are assumptions based on your instincts and filling in blanks?

r/DataHoarder archives a lot of data about this riot.

I think I'm helping seed at least one torrent from them. Which part should I be looking at for the staggering mountain of evidence that this isn't a pretty normal US protest?

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#749

Post by kangaroozach »

vladTheInhaler wrote: post #681
lliamander wrote: post #651

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wouldn't that first requiring proof of voter identification? I'm sure plenty of Trump supporters would be down with this plan.

The thing about voter ID is that it isn't inherently a bad idea, as long as you make it really cheap (ideally free) and convenient to get one . If republicans were actually interested in election integrity and civic participation, they wouldn't keep accidentally forgetting that part. But they're not, so in practice it ends up acting as a tool for discrimination and disenfranchisement.

If Democrats agreed to a universal free voterID for all US citizens that people can get at any post office, the Republicans would 100% go for it. All they truly want is a fair and trusted election. Any claim against this is based purely in conjecture and could easily be proven by simply pushing for some form of voter ID that is not discriminatory.

It’s the Democrats that say an ID to vote is racist, while saying an ID is not racist for things like driving, flying, buying alcohol, working, getting a firearm, welfare checks, and so much more.

It’s the Democrats that literally removed the signature requirement on ballots? (PA) What possible reason is there for this, if not to open the door for fraudulent voting, multiple votes per person etc...

Not a rhetorical question. Someone please help me understand the other side of this?

Re: Stripe bans Trump campaign

#750

Post by antibuddy »

trustfundbaby wrote: post #279

I was on the fence about this, but reading the comments convinced me it was the absolute right decision. The fact that all these institutions just allowed this horrible hateful speech for four years, in the name of free speech etc, despite all the harassment, harm (mental and otherwise) it caused to so many people in America actually emboldened so many to the extent that now that they crossed this invisible line, the…

What did Trump say/do that called for violence? Why could rioters just go to the capitol?

Seeing a dozen news articles the best argument seems to be that the mention of not attending the inauguration was a call for violence. I don't buy it.

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