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TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

reuters.com

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Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#731

Post by phatfish »

bloopernova wrote: post #713

Sid Meier's Alpha Centauri: "As the Americans learned so painfully in Earth's final century, free flow of information is the only safeguard against tyranny. The once-chained people whose leaders at last lose their grip on information flow will soon burst with freedom and vitality, but the free nation gradually constricting its grip on public discourse has begun its rapid slide into despotism. Beware of he who would d…

Maybe this soundbite applies in an information vacuum like North Korea or ironically, and to a lesser extent, China. But in an environment where there is too much information for people to process, and truth is drowned out by lies and nonsense on social media feeds, it works against society.

It's bad enough that US based social media corporations are allowed to wash their hands of responsibility for the content on their platform and add to the executive bonus pool in the process. But having a hostile government control a platform is just insane.

There is a middle ground between being bundled into the back of a police car if someone speaks against their government, and freely allowing enemies to manipulate your population.

Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#732

Post by hnpolicestate »

hxegon wrote: post #712
some_random wrote: post #624

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's mostly true and it's a good thing for the US to prevent hostile, autocratic, foreign powers from gaining undue cultural power.

The US is a hostile autocratic power with undue cultural power on our own citizens, so even if it's a given that TikTok is mostly a propaganda platform (which I completely, categorically disagree with), wouldn't it be better to at least have a choice? Or be able to compare between them? You are speaking as if US citizens don't deserve/ aren't capable of making their own decisions which is about as autocratic as it ge…

"You are speaking as if US citizens don't deserve/ aren't capable of making their own decisions" - the overwhelming majority of HN users would support U.K style ISP blocking of websites and apps deemed hostile to the government.

Endless comments about reciprocity, as if the American citizen doesn't have freedom of expression rights vastly different than Chinese citizens.

Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#734

Post by niobe »

martythemaniak wrote: post #530
bearjaws wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> TikTok has such a culture of authenticity and realness I must live in another universe because it all feels fake.

You're both right! There was a good article/discussion on on this yesterday, but tldr: They are authentically fake! As in, the creators are not putting up a show with a 'real' person behind the persona, the algorithms have remade whatever person there use to be such that their 'authentic' self has become the persona. https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=42696691

Go outside, everyone's real .. at least for the time being!

Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#735

Post by t-writescode »

fullshark wrote: post #595
bearjaws wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> TikTok has such a culture of authenticity and realness I must live in another universe because it all feels fake.

It's where the young kids who don't know any better overshare. Instagram is where the perfectly manicured young adults put out a phony facade to make their money.

My TikTok feed is full of very much adults and who own small businesses. I’ve seen some people in college, but there’s no kids in my feeds.

Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#736

Post by mint2 »

spencerflem wrote: post #67

Given how easy it is for China to buy US data legally from data brokers and how similar the functionality of TikTok and YouTube Shorts, I feel like the only explanations are: 1. The govt is mad that a foreign company is outcompeting a domestic one Or more likely, given that there are so many other industries that didn't get a ban: 2. The govt is mad that they have control over the narrative on Facebook but do not on…

but your 2. implies China has control rather than the US.

Isn’t that what the government has been saying?

Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#737

Post by LinXitoW »

whatevaa wrote: post #307
rwarfield wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The big issue isn't data security; it's propaganda. Irrespective of whether the government has control of the narrative on Facebook (I would argue they pretty clearly don't) there is no reason to let a foreign adversary have a deniable propaganda line to millions of Americans. Would we have let the USSR acquire a major television network? And even if you disagree with the national security reasons for disallowing Chi…

I just want to remind everyone that China/Russia is doing everything you dislike the West doing right now. Please talk when China/Russia opens up. Right now they spew propaganda into our societies with no way for us to retaliate. I don't like censorships but these one-way attacks are a weakness to democracies, not strengths. Open internet only works as long as everyone is friendly. The world is increasingly becoming…

Yes, but at least in the USA, I constantly have to hear shouting about how "free" everything is whenever I ask for sane regulations (guns), or something like universal healthcare.

If USA was actually so free, that would at least be consistent. But now I don't get TikTok, AND kids have to run around with bullet proof vests? I get all the bad, none of the good.

Every voting citizen should remember that this TikTok ban was bipartisan. That means they all cared more about this than ANY other sensible legislation. Banning child marriage? Nah! Protecting the childrens physical bodies in school was not as important as a hypothetical "mind attack" from TikTok.

They've literally said "Better a dead kid than a red kid"

Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#738

Post by munificent »

thorum wrote: post #537
bearjaws wrote: post #490

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> TikTok has such a culture of authenticity and realness I must live in another universe because it all feels fake.

Your perception of TikTok likely depends on your TikTok for you page. If you spend time cultivating it, the algorithm will learn you like authenticity and show you more of it. This seems to be less true on YouTube and Reels unfortunately.

> the algorithm will learn you like authenticity and show you more of it.

Jesus, this is like a line out of a William Gibson novel. I hope you wrote that aware of the irony inherent in it.

I'm also reminded of this George Burns quote: "The key to success is sincerity. If you can fake that you've got it made."

Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#739

Post by phatfish »

gaoshan wrote: post #556

Banning individual apps in this manner is wrong, IMO. In a country where concepts like freedom of speech and restrictions on government censorship are not insignificant considerations (in theory, at a minimum) a decision like this is unfortunate. China bans apps... tons of apps... in order to maintain strict control over the content and identity of users. This strategy is not something the US should be mimicking. The…

I broadly agree with this, but there was a path for the Tiktok app to not be banned, which is basically the China playbook of handing over control to a domestically controlled entity. Which in the case of a social media company with the reach of Tiktok i don't think is unreasonable.

Strengthened laws would be welcome, but all the social media companies would resist this as hard as they can. I don't see any real regulation happening until there is a crisis of some sort that will push it through against all the lobbyists and bought politicians.

Re: TikTok preparing for U.S. shut-off on Sunday

#740

Post by stonesthrowaway »

TulliusCicero wrote: post #670

I'm fine with this, based on the simple principle of Turnabout Is Fair Play . China already bans practically all the popular US social media apps and similar apps/websites. I'm for free trade, but it ought to be fair trade too, as in, roughly similar/equal policies. If another country bans X imports from your own, it's hardly unfair to respond in kind.

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