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They Used To Last 50 Years

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Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#731

Post by aurizon »

Cthulhu_ wrote: post #632
semi-extrinsic wrote: post #625

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's obvious that companies do this sort of thing. The main thing that prevented it in the past was that parts and labour were actually a significant cost, so things would be more expensive (in real terms) than today. When a TV or washing machine could be as much as 100% of a month's salary for a family, people couldn't afford a new one every 4 years. Companies realised this, so they made stuff that lasted longer. Bu…

I'm afraid your corollary won't apply; the lowest wages will just move elsewhere. There already was a company in China that moved production to the US because of wages there (plus transport costs, etc). I could see countries in Africa become the next manufacturing powerhouse(s), direct access to major seaways to both the US, Europe and Asia, etc. I don't know if they have the natural resources though, or the politica…

Ever notice how the high cost of wages in the USA combined with RORO car carriers (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roll-on/roll-off) to lose 85% of the UAW jobs in the USA? They allowed very low cost sea transport to the USA. The UAW constant striking for wages, perks and pensions (now close to $75 per hour)and other labor restrictive rules threw away 85% of their members jobs. This was an unintended consequence of greed and management parallel avarice who just upped the cost of cars by passing it to us. Now most people can own only used cars. The net effect also increased all other US wages - all of which now come home in spades. Furniture and matresses, locally built items can still be US made.

Remember - a bad job has low wages. I high wage job can also be bad - to the economy.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#732

Post by mrbill »

ballenf wrote: post #547
simonbyrne wrote: post #504

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Works for non electronics as well: restaurant tableware is much better value than the same brand consumer stuff (e.g. Wedgwood), as long you're happy with plain white and buying things in packs of 12.

webstaurant.com is awesome for getting restaurant grade stuff at reasonable prices. Pretty incredibly well designed website too in subtle ways. (no affiliation with them, just a fan) I bought some restaurant grade coffee mugs that are just fantastic. Pretty much impossible to chip and guaranteed.

Another vote for webstaurant.com, I buy all my cheap flatware there in bulk.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#733

Post by vanderZwan »

I wonder if switching to a model of renting appliances wouldn't improve this situation? If I rent out an appliance I want my hardware to last, and I have an incentive for the hardware to be good at the same time or I might lose customers to someone else.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#734

Post by vanderZwan »

I wonder if switching to a model of renting appliances wouldn't improve this situation? If I rent out an appliance I want my hardware to last, and I have an incentive for the hardware to be good at the same time or I might lose customers to someone else.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#735

Post by mrbill »

DiabloD3 wrote: post #527
tiatia wrote: post #252

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"would gladly pay $3000 for a washer" Miele. https://9to5mac.com/2011/03/07/how-steve-jobs-picks-a-washer...

I'd also like to say Miele is immortal. My Miele vacuum was handed down to me by my mother when she died, and it's like a decade old and has zero issues. And even if it does have issues, replacement parts for it are still sold (mainly because today's models are virtually identical). Also, without the HEPA filter addon, it meets HEPA requirements (they're just not allowed to say so because HEPA sues anyone that didn't…

I'm not sure about the current quality of their products, but I bought a refurbished Dyson "Animal" vacuum (the purple and grey one) in 2003.

We'd killed a couple of other vacuums previously (when you shave a St Bernard for a Texas summer...).

14 years later, I've never had to do any sort of major repair. Any problems I've ever had with the unit were fixed by taking it apart (without tools) and clearing the jam/clog.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#736

Post by cr0sh »

Fifer82 wrote: post #634
filterfish wrote: post #609

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a fucking washing machine, 10kg extra isn't going to make any difference.

I seen an article on the ring pulls on top of coke cans. They are hollow because it has a huge impact on raw materials usage (over the course of 10 million cans). I think every gram counts to the bottom line of the share holders no matter how mundane. Similar to the UK Construction Industry. Hit the minimum possible legal requirement and charge the maximum amount of money.

> They are hollow because it has a huge impact on raw materials usage

It's been a while, but I remember when the transition from pull tabs to "pop tabs" occurred; at first (IIRC), the "pop tabs" were solid, but it wasn't long until they became hollow as well.

Of course, that led to some problems which still exist today (though not nearly as often). The biggest one being the balance between the strength of the tab, vs the opening part (whatever it is called - closure?). In the past (and occasionally today for the odd soda), you could pull up on the tab - and it would bend or break off, without opening the soda! Simple enough to fix (do not press down on the opening with your thumb!) with a butter knife or some other similar tool, but annoying at the same time.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#737

Post by ibgib »

dredmorbius wrote: post #716
ibgib wrote: post #648

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What is ibGib? This is a broad question, as ibGib is many things. To be precise, it is its own question and answer, so the answer to this would be "ibGib". This would encompass your definition of ibGib, Bob's definition, etc., but this would probably overly pedantic. Basically it's different things and has many use cases. As for ibGib WRT software, it's an engine/architecture that I'm implementing ( https://github.…

That tells me much of what I need to know, thank you.

:-)

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#738

Post by jonnycoder »

Spooky23 wrote: post #673
modeopfer wrote: post #553

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I also studied engineering and I think your professor missed the point. You don't overengineer stuff anymore nowadays, not because you want to scam your consumer out of money (aka planned obsolence) but because the design tools got better and every gram of metal or plastic and every screw and every operation like welding, glueing and so on costs money. Nowadays simulation tools, new manufacturing processes and experi…

Fundamentally, you can't serve a turd and call it steak. Power tools are an example of how to get it right. If I go to Home Depot and look for a drill, it's obvious from the branding, battery, warranty and physical characteristics which DeWalt drill is the "ok" consumer one, and which is a professional tool. (I use this as an example because I bought one yesterday) The problem with consumer appliances is that they us…

Considering that Black & Decker own DeWalt, I wouldn't put much hope into your drill being a long lasting professional tool. I put my vote with Makita.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#739

Post by mrbill »

nkrisc wrote: post #554
Keverw wrote: post #199

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I remember seeing on HN a year or two ago? About Samsung smart fridges calendar app not being updated when Google phased out the API it was using. Also Blu-ray players don't get updates after a long while too I've heard as YouTube and Netflix changes their APIs - the devs of these devices don't keep them up to date. I would prefer a dumb TV, and just buy a replaceable box with the computer part. The only way I could…

I had to go out of my way to find a dumb TV. But when I found it, it was a few hundred cheaper than smart TVs of the same size. I saved money and headache!

When my mother bought a new 55" TV a couple of years ago, she didn't even know it was a smart TV (Android 4.4-based) until I came to visit and pointed it out.

She just ignores and never uses any of the smart features.

Re: They Used To Last 50 Years

#740

Post by PeterisP »

Pigo wrote: post #721
TheAdamAndChe wrote: post #683

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This exploitation of cheap foreign labor is a big reason why rural America is doing so poorly. Corporations used to go to rural America for cheap labor, but because of our environmental and labor laws as well as our higher standard of living, it's not viable. I honestly don't see how this trend can continue without destabilizing our country.

It makes me wonder if the people at the top could handle expecting less, could trends reverse themselves and more people benefit, or if it's beyond them with too many other factors to consider. Does it really all come down to "We have to grow every quarter or die"?

In any competitive market if one manufacturer decides to stray far from optimal behavior for such reasons, it won't even last a decade before their competitors overtake them (no matter if simply taking their marketshare, or with literal buyouts, or by taking over their assets in a bankruptcy/restructuring sale) and reverse those practices.

If the industry margin is e.g. 10%, then you might assume more beneficial practices that cost up to 10% if the company is privately held. Not more, and not anything significant if you're public - since if you do so, then it would be trivial for anyone with big resources (e.g. an investment bank or hedge fund) to buy your stock to gain a significant voting percentage, replace management with literally anyone else, and sell stock that immediately becomes so much more valuable.

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