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How to convert between wealth and income tax

paulgraham.com

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Re: How to convert between wealth and income tax

#721

Post by frmersdog »

AnthonyMouse wrote: post #699
frmersdog wrote: post #646

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't know what you're talking about. The corporate takeover of most rentals (apartments and homes alike) near the roadways and transit these people need to get to their jobs (let alone in areas where they wouldn't have to commute) has made those rentals inaccessible. They use little-known credit reporting companies specific to the rental industry that have basically no regulatory oversight, and which allow landl…

> The corporate takeover of most rentals (apartments and homes alike) near the roadways and transit these people need to get to their jobs (let alone in areas where they wouldn't have to commute) has made those rentals inaccessible. No they haven't: https://econofact.org/factbrief/do-private-equity-firms-own-... > They use little-known credit reporting companies specific to the rental industry that have basically no…

>No they haven't:

I said corporate, not PE.

>And then you rent from someone else because in reality large corporations own only a small percentage of rental units.

Most of the rest are owned by medium-sized corporations that use the same services.

>You're again only making the argument for getting rid of those grants people can't get anyway in favor of a UBI that everyone gets automatically.

UBI within the tax regime described above doesn't abolish the paternalism you're attacking, it just shifts it.

>How are they paying more money for anything to receive $1000 in cash instead of a $1000 payment that can only go to a landlord?

I am, once again, going to state that you don't seem to understand the topic at hand.

Or maybe you do, and pivoted to UBI because you realized that the tax issue was indefensible.

Re: How to convert between wealth and income tax

#722

Post by someguydave »

zzrrt wrote: post #297
someguydave wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

this post drips with envy

If they were saying that kings shouldn't have the unchecked right to execute people, this response would be akin to "Oh, you just wish you could kill anyone. Your argument is invalid."

No, I mean that the argument that someone is evil because of a number in their bank account is dumb, and a more likely explanation is simple envy

Re: How to convert between wealth and income tax

#723

Post by someguydave »

zzrrt wrote: post #466
abletonlive wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. The person saying that billionaires shouldn't exist is just failing to describe why that number is so mystical or interesting to them. If billionaires don't exist are we saying that people worth 500 million won't have power? you can keep doing this but the end result is the same. Power is asymmetrical and the system is self balancing. Those that have more wealth have more power. It's that simple. If you w…

Like saying, "There have never been more opportunities for commoners to become kings!" Okay, most of the people who say kings shouldn't exist will still feel that way, even if they could become king. > You are closer to a billionaire in your capabilities and agency in this society than a peasant was under an actual King. How much of that is because I live in a democratic republic, and not because billionaires exist?…

You are acting as an evil king, deciding for yourself who is moral and immoral on the basis of vibes

Re: How to convert between wealth and income tax

#724

Post by someguydave »

voidhorse wrote: post #596
abletonlive wrote: post #319

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. The person saying that billionaires shouldn't exist is just failing to describe why that number is so mystical or interesting to them. If billionaires don't exist are we saying that people worth 500 million won't have power? you can keep doing this but the end result is the same. Power is asymmetrical and the system is self balancing. Those that have more wealth have more power. It's that simple. If you w…

I think there is a massive difference between wanting power and wanting freedom and security from undue exploitation and/or economic hardship. Most people I know don't "want power". They just want to be able to afford basic necessities (food, housing, clothing) without feeling like they are on the brink of survival every day. Billionaires are starting to take the heat because people are starting to recognize that the…

People who want to do nothing and have others pay for their existence are generally evil

Re: How to convert between wealth and income tax

#725

Post by solidsnack9000 »

defrost wrote: post #609
solidsnack9000 wrote: post #555

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because a PE can have longer time horizons than a landlord or a real estate company?

"Landlords" (aka individual non corporate property owners of more than one residential dwelling) and real estate companies (those with portfolio's of land assets rather than those that just take a commission on sale) can do pretty much the same thing if the numbers pan that way and/or they have no stomach for dealing with Tennants for marginal extra profit. Ownership of rentable property that is empty is a thing acro…

It seems like you're saying, that PE, landlords, &c, are in a market where a landowner can hold on to property, not rent it out or put it to other productive use, and still make money. That is a problem, but not a problem with wealth or wealthy people per se.

Re: How to convert between wealth and income tax

#726

Post by vannevar »

trollbridge wrote: post #695
vannevar wrote: post #572

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you properly taxed real estate in a progressive way, you wouldn't have to bother with taxing paper wealth at all---the collective value of paper is already reflected in the price of land. People with large paper fortunes inevitably buy real estate, and when they do, their paper wealth inflates the price. This is why median residential housing prices have dramatically outpaced median wage increases, along with anyt…

What level of property tax are you proposing? Raising property taxes raises housing costs for everyone.

A progressive property tax would actually lower housing costs, by reducing real estate prices. There would be a homestead exemption, so there would be no impact on taxes for individual homeowners. I think it would tend to stabilize rents, as larger landholders would be forced to shed properties, which would be snapped up by smaller ones. The overall effect would be a decentralization of real estate, which in turn means a decentralization of wealth.
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