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Cloudflare Global Network experiencing issues

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Re: Cloudflare Global Network experiencing issues

#723
What would the Internet's architecture have to look like for DDOS'ing to be a thing of the past, and therefore Cloudflare to not be needed?

I know there are solutions like IPFS out there for doing distributed/decentralised static content distribution, but that seems like only part of the problem. There are obviously more types of operation that occur via the network -- e.g. transactions with single remote pieces of equipment etc, which by their nature cannot be decentralised.

Anyone know of research out there into changing the way that packet-routing/switching works so that 'DDOS' just isn't a thing? Of course I appreciate there are a lot of things to get right in that!

Re: Cloudflare Global Network experiencing issues

#725

What do we actually lose going from cloud back to ground? The mass centralization is a massive attack vector for organized attempts to disrupt business in the west. But we’re not doing anything about it because we’ve made a mountain at of a molehill. Was it that hard to manage everything locally? I get that there’s plenty of security implications going that route, but it would be much harder to bring down t large por…

> What do we actually lose going from cloud back to ground?

A lot of money related to stuff you currently don't have to worry about.

I remember how shit worked before AWS. People don't remember how costly and time consuming this stuff used to be. We had close to 50 people in our local ops team back in the day when I was working with Nokia 13 years ago. They had to deal with data center outages, expensive storage solutions failing, network links between data centers, offices, firewalls, self hosted Jira running out of memory, and a lot of other crap that I don't spend a lot of time about worrying with a cloud based setup. Just a short list of stuff that repeatedly was an issue. Nice when it worked. But nowhere near five nines of uptime.

That ops team alone cost probably a few million per year in salaries alone. I knew some people in that team. Good solid people but it always seemed like a thankless and stressful job to me. Basically constant firefighting while getting people barking at you to just get stuff working. Later a lot of that stuff moved into AWS and things became a lot easier and the need for that team largely went away. The first few teams doing that caused a bit of controversy internally until management realized that those teams were saving money. Then that quickly turned around. And it wasn't like AWS was cheap. I worked in one of those teams. That entire ops team was replaced by 2-3 clued in devops people that were able to move a lot faster. Subsequent layoff rounds in Nokia hit internal IT and ops teams hard early on in the years leading up to the demise of the phone business.

Re: Cloudflare Global Network experiencing issues

#728

How did we get to a place where either Cloudflare or AWS having an outage means a large part of the web going down? This centralization is very worrying.

Because no one cares enough, including users.

Oddly this centralization allows a complete deferral of blame without you even doing anything: if you’re down, that’s bad. But if you’re down, Spotify is down, social media is down… then “the internet is broken” and you don’t look so bad.

It also reduces your incentive to change, if “the internet is down” people will put down their device and do something else. Even if your web site is up they’ll assume it isn’t.

I’m not saying this is a good thing but I’m simply being realistic about why we ended up where we are.

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